TWiT 190/Transcript

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Episode 190


This transcript is provided by our friends at Pods in Print

Leo Laporte Bandwidth for this WEEK in TECH is provided by AOL Radio at

This is TWiT, this WEEK in TECH, episode 190 for April 13, 2009, Gripping Jobs.

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This is TWiT, this WEEK in TECH, episode 190 with great cast of characters sitting around drinking wine and talking about the latest tech news. I will start with our in-studio, a guest, just one but I am so glad to have her. Neha Tiwari is here. It’s good to have you.

Neha Tiwari Hi, thank you for having me.

Leo Laporte Neha, I just found out, was an intern in the last days of TechTV. She actually was the band that played Nearer, My God, to Thee as the ship sank.

Neha Tiwari True.

Leo Laporte And then went on to Revision3, hosted Pop Siren, produced Tekzilla, and we are so glad to have you. Welcome.

Neha Tiwari Thank you.

Leo Laporte Back from three months in India.

Neha Tiwari Yes, little bit of a break from Live Tech.

Leo Laporte You can give us the perspective – the Indians’ perspective on tech, although you were saying that – where you are in northern India, wasn’t that wired?

Neha Tiwari Not really. I mean sometimes you would see people on the trains using laptops and stuff like that. The cybercafe is still very-very popular...

Leo Laporte That’s where people go.

Neha Tiwari India, and that’s where – I mean, having a home computer is not something that’s widespread other than the metros; in other cities not as much.

Leo Laporte The internet cafe.

Neha Tiwari Yes.

Leo Laporte It’s kind of like that in other parts of the world, I think.

Neha Tiwari I think so too. When I was in China, I saw some internet cafes...

Leo Laporte Yes, yes.

Neha Tiwari ...there, but they weren’t as frequent. I didn’t see them as frequently as I did in India. So – but it was interesting because I am one of those people that wakes up and gets on their computer and is just glued to it the entire day, I’m sure a lot of you are the same way. And so, in India, I was unable to do that and it was just interesting to go outside and get some fresh air and interact with real people, so...

Leo Laporte Pretty cool.

Neha Tiwari Yes.

Leo Laporte Speaking of fresh air and real people, from Oxford, England, our good buddy, Mr. Wil Harris, long time no see. He has got a little glass of Sancerre there. Hey, Wil. Oh, no, he has lost his audio. Unmute it thyself.

Wil Harris Sorry. Hello, it’s great to be here.

Leo Laporte It’s great now that I can see you.

Wil Harris I’m out of practice.

Leo Laporte And I can see you via Skypesaurus. Not only do – I know you’re speaking, we are not hearing, but I can see what you are drinking and when.

Wil Harris All the way through.

Leo Laporte John won’t let us do that. Also here from Port Angeles in the northern – westernmost part of the United States of America for the Continental U.S., John C. Dvorak. Hi, John.

John C. Dvorak Hey, there.

Leo Laporte Good to have you. How was your Easter?

John C. Dvorak It’s still going on.

Leo Laporte Did you hide eggs for the little ones?

John C. Dvorak We don’t actually have any little ones but we did hide eggs and, of course, now the eggs have money in them.

Leo Laporte That gets the kids going.

John C. Dvorak So, everybody is so glad to participate.

Leo Laporte Gold coins. The leprechauns have been here. Wow, that’s a great idea. I was trying to hide eggs for my kid, my 14-year-old. I said, “Henry, can I hide some eggs?” He said, “No.”

John C. Dvorak Put a couple of bucks in each one, or a fiver and you will see he’ll change his song.

Leo Laporte You came up with a very good idea. People like how John sounds when he is in Port Angeles, when he is up in Washington State and the reason is, John?

John C. Dvorak It’s because I am using the fabulous PR 40 from Heil.

Leo Laporte Heil PR 40. Isn’t it warm and luscious and delicious?

John C. Dvorak What I don’t like about it is that, in fact, I think people should consider this when they are podcasting, it’s a – it’s not a condenser so that saves you typically $100 for a little preamp and it does not need a compressor. So, essentially, you save like $200 right off the top for – at least, I mean you could really rack those numbers up if you want to. And the mike, I think, is around 400. So, it’s the equivalent of a $200 expense overall as opposed to an – the mike I use is an AKG, costs about the same but I need these two pieces of equipment.

Leo Laporte Yes. No, I like it.

John C. Dvorak So, it’s easier.

Leo Laporte Way to go. So, how do you get that? I don’t understand though. You are getting the – because it isn’t a normal mike in the sense that, I mean, it’s a professional mike. So, you just can plug it in right into the side of the...

John C. Dvorak No, no, I have an AM audio.

Leo Laporte You still are using AM audio?

John C. Dvorak Yes, I just brought a second one for a peer, and the funny thing is that I decided to get it online so I scrounged around and I found some source. I mean, these things cost I think about 150 bucks or something like that. And so, I found a source and they were like $49. You refurbish they say. So, I get the thing and it’s exactly the same, exactly, and it looks like it’s never been used or touched, and it’s got these big labels on the box saying “be stock”, not for retail or something like that. And so, if you – I am happy with it. It’s exactly the same as the other one.

Leo Laporte [6:07] I think we can thank – I don’t if it was the California State Legislature or the courts for this because Dell, I think, it was selling computers that have been returned. If somebody bought it and opened the box, didn’t want it and returned it as new and somebody sued and the court said, “No, you can’t sell that stuff as new.” And as a result, all these companies have to sell the stuff that isn’t really used, it’s returned or box is opened, they can’t sell it as new and so they – we get this great benefit although for 50 bucks is a big – I mean most of the companies, Dell sells this stuff and doesn’t give you that kind of a break.

John C. Dvorak No, this – and I have to recommend this thing. I mean, people – when I first started working over at Mevio to get up to speed on all the stuff, I remember, and this was like a couple of years ago, I remember everybody saying, “No, no, you can’t use the USB, you can’t go through it under any circumstances, it sucks”. You have to somehow go through – this is what it does and I think it sounds just as good as anything I have heard that goes...

Leo Laporte Fully digital, I agree. It’s really a question whether you got good mike preamps and I think it has good mike preamps. We are using it to send my audio to you and we use AM Audio – slightly higher in AM Audio, just because that’s what they had in stock and your audio is coming out that way. So, it works fine. So, you brought up, Wil Harris, you brought up the first story of the day and a surprising story. The guys who created Skype which we use to do this show, you are on Skype, John’s on Skype.

John C. Dvorak And you make it look like Wil Harris is John C. Dvorak.

Leo Laporte I know I have to type a new lower third forum.

John C. Dvorak I’m just saying that.

Leo Laporte Now that John’s watching the video, he is not so nice. They want to buy Skype back. What’s the story there?

Wil Harris So, well – according to the New York Times anyway, Niklas Zennstrom and Janus Friis who are the guys that actually started Skype sold it to eBay for close to what like 2.50 billion, 3....

Leo Laporte It ended up being 3.1 billion after all was said and done, yes.

Wil Harris And then – and now eBay has kind, who originally bought, I think, to integrate with eBay so you could chat to the dealers and sellers, etcetera, never really sort of did it. It’s costing them stupendous amounts of money allegedly to keep it running.

Leo Laporte Yes, why did eBay them in the first place? It would mean...

Wil Harris Well, I think, what they wanted to do was have it so that if you were on eBay and you wanted to ask a question off your seller, which is like the number one impediment to buying something, if you want to know something, is that you could just easily call someone.

Leo Laporte Yes, and the number one thing that sellers didn’t want to do is talk to the buyers.

Wil Harris Yes, of course, their customers, right. So, it’s a slight disaster but – so, they are now looking to buy it back and eBay, according to the story – analysts say that eBay is looking for 1.7 billion. So, they are looking to get back half their money.

Neha Tiwari They want a lot of money for it. They are not going to let it go.

Wil Harris However, they are saying that that 1.7 billion, that’s the value of Skype on the eBay balance sheet in 2007. So, you could imagine that the difference between the price in 2007 and the price today, in the current market is going to be looking a little bit different. These guys could get it back for less than a billion and probably flip it again in another two or three years.

Leo Laporte Point talking about profit and they are going to have a $2 billion profit out of this thing or a $1.50 billion out of this thing.

Neha Tiwari I wonder, I mean their new project Joost or their semi-new project, I mean it seems to be doing okay.

Leo Laporte There is no money in that. You think there is?

Neha Tiwari No, I don’t think there is money in it, but I think that they have good partnerships with networks and things like that and they have some decent content on it.

Leo Laporte Right. How – I wonder what their model is for making money on that today.

Wil Harris Well, they are both making money as always – Joost has always been – to put ads in the content....

Neha Tiwari Yes.

Wil Harris And then rev share.

Neha Tiwari I think they have pre-rolls, if I’m not.

Wil Harris Yes, they do pre-roll enabling that kind of thing and they wanted to monetize the community to start generating shafts around TV and then to start monetizing that kind of community. Actually, they have kind of gotten nowhere, it’s kind of an open secret and nobody is buying ads. The content is all the kind of stuff you can get everywhere else for free anyway.

Leo Laporte It’s kind of junk they have, it’s like Dukes of Hazard quality. I mean, it’s not…

Wil Harris And they had the desktop client that is supposed to be the future of TV but nobody really wanted a desktop client and so they change it to flash, but then they had to go and raise hundreds more – millions of dollars to keep the thing going and I think most people can see it tanking pretty quickly.

Neha Tiwari And when it comes to the model, I think Hulu just has it going on. I mean, a lot of people really like Hulu. I like Hulu, and...

Leo Laporte I would bet Hulu is not making money. You do that? I don’t know.

Wil Harris And you say that but of course Hulu is not actually available anywhere outside of the United States.

Leo Laporte That’s the difference…

Neha Tiwari Joost is international.

Wil Harris Yes.

Leo Laporte Of course, you know a little about this, Wil, because as the guy who runs ChannelFlip, you’re trying to make money in IPTV as well.

Wil Harris Absolutely.

Leo Laporte Do you see Joost as a competitor?

Wil Harris Not really. Joost come and sort of ask us for our content, and the general line is, well, how much it’s going to be worth, and the general line is, well, we might bill to pay you a few dollars every month which is absolutely ridiculous. So, we aren’t really seeing them as a competitor at all. They are not making any content and that’s what it’s all about in the current day and age. As you well know, it’s all about making the stuff.

Leo Laporte Jamie’s saying in our Friendfeed conversation that he believes Hulu is making money, but do you think so, Wil. I mean you know what it would take to money.

Wil Harris Oh, for sure.

Leo Laporte You think they are making money?

Wil Harris …yes. So, the reason Hulu can make money is because they are basically selling ads on what’s already like a sunk cost.

Leo Laporte That’s a good point. The only cost to them at this point is bandwidth.

Neha Tiwari Right.

Wil Harris Right. So, the cost of making the content is like zero to go on like as they have already sunk cost for TVs. So, anything they can make out of it online is just covering bandwidth and making profit.

Leo Laporte It’s incremental profit.

Wil Harris Yes, now whether you can maintain that going forward when there’s less money in TV budgets is a kind of different question.

Leo Laporte I mean, I love Hulu but I have to say I don’t know how many ads – I mean, there’s not a lot of ads in there.

Neha Tiwari Well, there’s again, I mean, with every show that you watch there is ….

Leo Laporte There is enough.

Neha Tiwari There is going to be second pre-roll and I have – I haven’t seen, I think they also employ mid-roll too.

Leo Laporte Yes, they do. There are interstitial ads in there.

Neha Tiwari Yes, I mean, I would almost say that it’s heavily advertised ….

Leo Laporte Compared to other net content.

Neha Tiwari Compared to other networks that are doing content.

Leo Laporte Wil, is it – is that – how is the ad sales going at ChannelFlip. Are people buying?

Wil Harris Yes, it’s really interesting, I mean, without getting sort of too-inside-baseball, it’s really interesting that TV spend in the U.K. is down drastically, online spend is up drastically and in particular, online video is really the only area where the market is holding up.

Leo Laporte That’s been our experience too. Our advertising – we can’t…

Wil Harris I think, what you see is that generic media, the sort of MSNs of the world see their CPMs tanking because you have no idea who the audience is. The way you can connect with a specialist audience and you know who that audience is – with your podcasts you know all the kind of people that are going to be listening to this, you know all the demographic data, you do observe those and that audience is really-really valuable, whereas a generic 10 million people turn up to MSN, is like, oh, who the hell are these people.

Leo Laporte We are going to come back in just a bit and talk more about hitters been twacked. I mean, twackers been hitted. I shouldn’t have had that wine before the show, Twitter has been hacked twice by the same Brooklyn kid who says, yes, I did it, it was me, I was the guy. We kind of knew because he sent everybody to his site. We will talk about that in just a little bit, also they are closing the pub on the Microsoft campus and the employees are getting together to save it.

Before we do that, though I want to mention our friends at Audible is a great place to go and get your audio entertainment. You love podcasts, you are going to love Audio books: 50,000 plus titles, it’s the world’s greatest library of audio books and I think it even does a service to say audio books, Audible is really – these are performances. Some of the best readers reading some of the most amazing literature, it is a wonderful resource. You can learn while you are doing things that normally be completely time wasted like sitting in the car, driving, going to the gym working out. Give it a try right now and get the audible platinum account by going to, That’s – when you sign for a platinum, that’s the one I have, you get two books a month, I go through two books a month, so I need that.

And you could choose from any of the books here, you get a credit. Some of the books are two credits but you can – but it’s an amazing thing. It’s like eating wine – I am drinking wine right now. I think we should be talking about a little bit about food. And I am going to recommend a wonderful book, actually this is a TV program. Have you seen the Splendid Table. They have TV shows on here too, the audio from the TV shows, this is Lynne Rossetto Kasper’s incredible TV show and this is the one where she interviews the author of Julie and Julia: 365 Days, 524 Recipes and 1 Tiny Apartment – have you – this is – I’m actually going to recommend that book because we recommend before on Jumping Monkeys. What a story, this is a woman who ended up deciding to cook every recipe in Julie Child's famous the Art of French Cooking, 524 recipes in one year and that’s her story of doing that.

This is just an example, I mean, it’s everything from soup to nuts. I mean, you can – business, classics, education, fiction, history, young adults, great for the kids, mysteries, thrillers even romance and of course lots of science and technology and sci-fi and fantasy titles. I want you to try it right now, go to, sign up for the platinum account. You are going to love it, We thank them so much for their support of this WEEK in TECH. Theirs is an example of an advertiser that just can’t get enough of podcasts, so they are buying a lot of podcasts, they’ve supported us, now we are in our second year of advertising with them. I think it’s what you said, Wil, I think that there’s a – it’s almost a contrarian market. We are doing better than we did when the economy was good.

Wil Harris Well, exactly everybody likes a good bit of specific advertising and when you guys are talking about Audible, it’s really useful. I have got a Platinum plan which I had signed up for three days – yes, of course.

Leo Laporte That’s awesome, very cool.

Wil Harris I’m listening to a lot of Terry Pratchett. I met Terry Pratchett last week.

Leo Laporte You did?

Wil Harris Yes.

Leo Laporte I’m so jealous. Terry Pratchett wrote the Discworld books. He is one of the best, funniest fantasy writers, huge fan, suffering from Alzheimer's.

Wil Harris Terrible, terrible, but still very with it. I’m going to horrendously name drop, being – and just go that when I was at the exclusive screening of the new Red Dwarf last week he turned up.

Leo Laporte Bobby Llewellyn was there, did you say hi to Bobby Llew?

Wil Harris Absolutely, and I got in on his ticket, which was fantastic.

Leo Laporte Congratulate him on the re-launch of Red Dwarf. That’s such good news.

Wil Harris Fantastic job I thought.

Leo Laporte Really, you liked it? I haven’t seen it. We haven’t seen it here yet.

Wil Harris No you wouldn’t. I hear you couldn’t get it.

Leo Laporte I have to get on the ball and start downloading. Somewhere, I’ll find it.

Wil Harris Yes.

Leo Laporte That is great. Yes, so how was Sir Terry Pratchett?

Wil Harris Very well, he was giving red carpet interviews all night, even though it was nothing to do with him. He sort of turned up I think and saw the sort of red carpet where all the camera crews were and was like ‘ah red carpet! I must need to be on that.’

Leo Laporte ‘I am Terry Pratchett.’

Wil Harris ‘I am’, proceed to spend the whole evening giving interviews and things, which is fantastic.

Leo Laporte He – I saw a weird article about him something – some helmet, that he’s – a brain helmet, that he is wearing. Did you see this – the magic light helmet. That tells him – will let him write because he said…

Wil Harris Oh yes.

Leo Laporte …despite the Alzheimer’s he’s still writing. But he says it’s very slow going, he might write a sentence a day. So he is using this bizarre light helmet that Dr. Gordon Dougal invented it and it’s suppose to slow Alzheimer’s. I think it sounds pretty...

Wil Harris Well it’s – well listen if the listeners are jonesing for a bit of Terry Pratchett, Audible has a great selection of Pratchett that’s read by a guy called Nigel Planer.

Leo Laporte Yes.

Wil Harris And Nigel Planer is very famous for being in The Young Ones which was a kind of seminal British comedy of the ‘80s.

Leo Laporte Didn’t know that.

Wil Harris And Nigel Planer does a very, very good Discworld book.

Leo Laporte There’s the light helmet, it’s got – you know what, this is a joke. It’s got three muffin fans from a lap – from a desktop computer on it. It looks absolutely insane. But anything that helps Terry, right, I’m all for it.

Yeah I listened to, in fact I have, boy I probably have a dozen audible Discworld books. The first one’s on there, The Colour of Magic, that’s the one you should start with.

Wil Harris Yes.

Leo Laporte You meet Rincewind and I love that stuff.

Wil Harris And also Mort. Mort is my favorite, actually, because of the introduction of Death and such, it’s quite good.

Leo Laporte But I like Rincewind because he’s kind of, he’s like a Merlin but he is completely inept and terrified and goofy and it’s just great. He is like a bad, bad wizard, like a wizard who’s no good – he sucks.

Wil Harris Incompetent.

Leo Laporte Incompetent wizard.

[19:56] Let’s talk a little bit about, I don’t know, I didn’t, I’m kind of sandbagging here with this, because this story just came out. The Spitfire Club was going to open on Microsoft’s Entertainment and Devices Division campus. They were going to open a pub and they – for – Microsoft used to go to I guess, because they are afraid of going out in the real world, I don’t know. And they pulled the plug on the project. The owner Jonathan Sposato says ‘I am completely stunned and disappointed by the decision, I’m confused by the sudden change of heart.‘ Spitfire apparently is a pub also in Seattle’s Belltown neighbourhood. Ever been there, Jon? The Spitfire pub?

John C. Dvorak No, never.

Leo Laporte Is this a good idea to have a pub on the campus in Microsoft? See companies do this so you’ll never leave.

John C. Dvorak I think yes.

Leo Laporte Yes.

Neha Tiwari I am sure a lot of the people who work at Microsoft spend a lot of hours there. So, it might have been a good idea.

Leo Laporte They’ve been doing this, developing this for more than a year, there was a competitive bidding process just weeks before it was opened. He had to fire the 22 employees he’d hired.

Wil Harris It’s crazy. I mean I find it bizarre that Microsoft can have a gun club but not a pub.

Leo Laporte They have a gun club?

Wil Harris Well apparently there’s a video on YouTube has Microsoft gun club April 2009 finale, from their second amendment day. So, go Microsoft.

Leo Laporte Hysterical.

John C. Dvorak So, here’s a piece of news that’s kind of interesting, that’s not being under covered.

Leo Laporte Yes, sir?

John C. Dvorak These cables have been clipped down in San Jose area.

Leo Laporte Yes, this was sabotage.

John C. Dvorak And so I did a column in MarketWatch on this and then I got a note from someone saying South Carolina also had a similar situation, none of this has been reported. And then Eric, you know, of our channel Dvorak, Eric, my son, he mentions that there was a clip between Washington DC and some, I guess some part of Virginia and so it looks like somebody is out there just…

Leo Laporte I have a theory on this.

John C. Dvorak …clipping to see what the heck’s – to see what the results are, I guess.

Leo Laporte I have a theory on this. So, for those who didn’t know, because it was kind of a local story, San Jose, South Bay, the Silicon Valley’s phone service, including cell service completely died, was out for most of the day, tens of thousands of people without any service.

John C. Dvorak 50,000 actually.

Leo Laporte They discovered that it was intentional sabotage but get this – this is where the fiber cables are. The person would have had to open, move a fairly hefty manhole cover. They, well, first they have to know where they are going, right. I mean, there’s a lot of manhole covers. They move the right manhole cover, climb down, it’s about two feet of water they’d be standing in. They would have to know which cables to cut. And they did all of that. This is not just random vandalism.

John C. Dvorak Right.

Leo Laporte So, I bet you’re thinking the same thing I’m thinking John C. Dvorak.

John C. Dvorak What?

Leo Laporte Terrorists.

John C. Dvorak Well, I was – yes, that’s what I was thinking, actually. But it seems like, I don’t know what kind of terrorists it would be. I mean, it could be blackmailers or extortionists.

Leo Laporte Well first of all you’d have to know, I mean, this is not – I wouldn’t know how to do this.

John C. Dvorak It’s non trivial.

Leo Laporte Non trivial.

Wil Harris Why would you do it though?

Leo Laporte I think it’s a rehearsal.

Wil Harris What’s the benefit?

Leo Laporte It’s a rehearsal, it’s the same reason the bad guys put software on the electrical grid, we discovered this last week. Wall Street Journal published a big story saying there’s software designed to shutdown the electrical grid on many computers on our electrical grid never used. It’s sitting there. So, my theory is if you’re – look – if you’re bad guys, if you’re either terrorists or foreign nationals and you’re planning warfare, you need to know how this stuff works. What you do is you try it out, you do a rehearsal. You see if it works. And you hope that it’s three isolated incidents since nobody is going to put two and two together, you’ve got to hope that – I hope that the Department of Homeland Security is at least as smart as John C. Dvorak, but I think that’s what is going on. Who else would be doing this? You think it’s blackmail, John?

John C. Dvorak Well, I mean, there’s are extortionists out there that pull this kind of thing. And they do it with oil refineries, they do it all – we’re going to do this and that if you don’t give us money. Although – and we’d, probably we’d never find out if that was the case, because who the heck is going to tell us that somebody paid somebody off in a situation like this? I am not sure, what…

Leo Laporte Yes, we don’t know, l guess it could be, could be –

John C. Dvorak The things is I’d like to get a call out, anybody who has any – if this is, anybody sees it happening any place else in the country, I think these are all typically locally reported and nobody’s seeing it as a national story. I mean I did write it up in MarketWatch as a, what I thought was a national story.

Leo Laporte It is a national story.

John C. Dvorak And –

Leo Laporte The fact that they were able to cut this fiber, they knew where to go, they were able to, I mean –

John C. Dvorak I also pointed out the fact that like for example, we have a lot of fiber up here and it’s very clearly marked. I mean it’s along the side of the road –

Leo Laporte Oh it does say, ‘cut here to disconnect phone service’?

John C. Dvorak No, no, no, they tell you where the cable is, because they want people with backhose ripping it out. And so, we can – it doesn’t take a genius to find this stuff.

Leo Laporte The outage affected some cell phones’ internet, access in about 52, 200 Verizon household landlines in Santa Cruz and San Jose counties, cell phone networks by Verizon, Nextel and Sprint and some AT&T networks were also out. This; pretty effective, little too easy, if you ask me.

John C. Dvorak Yes, I think that’s really what the problem is, and I think it’s – I think people, I think it’s vulnerable.

Leo Laporte ATMs knocked out, San Jose. St. Louis Regional Hospital in Gilroy cancelled elective surgeries.

Neha Tiwari Wow.

Leo Laporte I mean it’s a big deal, when this kind of thing happens.

Neha Tiwari I think it can be devastating to any community when something like this goes down and people don’t understand the magnitude of how important it is to address these things. There’s – I think people see this, not as a direct act of maybe something like terrorism and therefore they don’t address as that or as a major issue.

Leo Laporte Well, we’re, I think, I hope John, that you hear from somebody, because I think that this certainly raises that specter.

John C. Dvorak Yeah. And I wouldn’t be surprised if there is some other outages here and there that just haven’t been reported, because obviously this is a local thing. But I mean, the idea would be, just guessing, that you would want to take a – kind of map the fiber network or see which are important and find ones that intersect, or in other words you would have a whole area that could possibly be blacked out, like a whole city let’s say…

Leo Laporte Right, right.

John C. Dvorak …by two cuts some place. Because everything is – the network is not so – I mean it used to be, well the internet is supposed to be redundant and it’s designed for – to take an A bomb and all this stuff. That’s not true any more. There was a lot –

Leo Laporte I don’t if it was ever true but it’s certainly not true now.

John C. Dvorak It may not have ever been true, but whatever the case is, it’s not that redundant.

Leo Laporte Yes, no kidding, if you can knock it out by clipping a couple of things.

Speaking of bad actors, Mikeyy Mooney is a name you might want to keep in mind, Mikeyy,with two Ys. He is seventeen years old, he has a little website called, S-T-A-L-K. Don’t go there!

Neha Tiwari Don’t go there.

Leo Laporte Don’t go there! He created a cross site scripting exploit that took advantage of a flaw in Twitter. How many flaws are there going to be in Twitter? How complicated is Twitter and why is it that it keeps getting hacked?

John C. Dvorak Why do they keep adding weird stuff? Now when you tweet something you’ve got to drop down that says ‘your thing has been updated’ and then it goes back up.

Leo Laporte I haven’t seen that, because I haven’t used Twitter in a while, I am ready to leave…

John C. Dvorak You hate Twitter.

Leo Laporte I hate it.

Neha Tiwari Twitter is, I mean it’s been a little wonky. I mean…

Leo Laporte It’s really wonky. Fail Whales and –

Neha Tiwari …Fail Whales and over capacity, I get a lot of over capacity, Twitter is over capacity.

Leo Laporte Yes, well, that’s, of course …

Neha Tiwari I mean it happens, but it…

Leo Laporte Well…

Neha Tiwari …can be really frustrating too.

Leo Laporte It’s what’s his name? Ashton Kutcher. It’s the Ashton Kutcher phenomenon.

Neha Tiwari Yes, it’s really weird to hear about Twitter on pop literature.

Wil Harris Or tweeting pictures of Demi Moore’s butt?

Leo Laporte Yes, that will bring a site down.

Neha Tiwari The Ashton Kutcher effect.

Leo Laporte It’s the A+K effect. So, this guy Mikeyy says, ‘I am aware of the attack and yes I am behind the attack.’ Mikeyy described how he carried it out to, I think it was to –

John C. Dvorak You think that’s his voice?

Leo Laporte Well, what do you think his voice sounds like?

John C. Dvorak ‘Hi.’

Leo Laporte No, I don’t think it’s hot.

John C. Dvorak I think he’s got a macho voice, you know. He is probably a very intelligent young man.

Neha Tiwari Well, he is seventeen. So the voice must have dropped by now.

Leo Laporte I think Mikeyy doesn’t get out much.

John C. Dvorak I think Mikeyy is a fine upstanding citizen. You are just berating him for no good reason. Mikeyy, Leo you know where he is.

Leo Laporte You just don’t want to get hacked, John.

Wil Harris So, wait a minute, what does Mikkey’s virus actually do?

Leo Laporte Okay, Mikeyy says ‘I am the person who coded the XSS’ that’s across-site scripting exploit, ‘which them acted as a worm when it auto-updated the user’s profile and status, which then infected other users who viewed their profile. I did this out of boredom, to be honest. I usually like to find vulnerabilities within websites and try not to cause too much damage, but start a worm or something to give the developers an insight on the problem. And while doing so, promoting myself and my website.’ Mikeyy not too bright, Mikeyy pointed everybody to his website, Mikeyy basically said ‘I did it’ in big red letters.

Neha Tiwari Yes. Mikeyy’s clearly not...

John C. Dvorak You sound a lot like Frink.

Wil Harris Mikeyy expecting a knock on the door from the...

Leo Laporte No, Frink is more like – he’s going to be Professor Frink when he grows up, I think. Infected users’ passwords were not compromised, according to Mikeyy, anyway. Although, I do notice that Twitter said change your password, you might want to change your password.

Neha Tiwari Well, it’s only if you were affected by it though.

Leo Laporte Right. And they also suggest killing cookies, clearing your cache, changing your password.

Neha Tiwari Right.

Leo Laporte And deleting all those messages saying…

Neha Tiwari Go to the site.

Leo Laporte …go to

Neha Tiwari .com, right. Yes, when I read the story, it was the first thing I checked though.

Leo Laporte Did you go to

Neha Tiwari No, I didn’t. And thank God, I had no such hacking done. Nor did any of my friends that I saw on my feed at least.

Leo Laporte I didn’t get hacked.

Neha Tiwari No.

John C. Dvorak Isn’t this a – some sort of a felony?

Leo Laporte Yes. Yes that would be it, a felony. It’s against the wire, what is it? They probably still have this, the wire fraud rules, I think that’s the – that’s what they use to prosecute.

Neha Tiwari The wire fraud rules!

Leo Laporte They’ve used that to prosecute people, yes.

John C. Dvorak Yes, there is some wire fraud rule that keeps people from – but anyway, the point is why would he…

Wil Harris But is it the case that you could only get hacked that you actually went to

Leo Laporte Hold on, hold on, hold on, one at a time. Finish your thought, John, and then I’ll let you talk.

John C. Dvorak The question is why would he admit to this – apparently he doesn’t know that it’s a felony maybe, but the second thing, that bigger question and always is the bigger question, why hasn’t somebody knocked on his door?

Leo Laporte Somebody must have, by now. We know he lives in Brooklyn, we know his name, we know his website.

Neha Tiwari Yes, there is plenty of information about him.

Leo Laporte He says, I also, I have run

Neha Tiwari Yes, in fact he is using the media now to still promote what he is doing.

Leo Laporte Yes.

Neha Tiwari He hasn’t stopped.

Leo Laporte No.

Neha Tiwari Mikeyy Mooney is still at it.

John C. Dvorak And of course our law enforcement is doing what exactly?

Leo Laporte ‘I hear, there were some lines in San Jose that were cut, I don’t know. Is that related?’

Leo Laporte The tweet that you would get, here it is, I’ll go to StalkDaily so you don’t have to. It’s got, looks like it’s got a picture of Elmer Fudd. And here is the, here’s what he posts on this site. ‘I have came clean and accepted the responsibility for the worm, read the interview here.’

Neha Tiwari ‘I have came clean?’ That isn’t – that’s even, the grammar…

Leo Laporte ‘I have came clean.’ He looks like he completely stole the code from Twitter.

Neha Tiwari Yes.

Leo Laporte It’s even got the same, let’s see if it’s got the Twitter Terms of Service.

Neha Tiwari It basically was – it’s like a clone, I think, of Twitter.

Leo Laporte He stole the – he stole everything, let’s see the Privacy Policy. StalkDaily provides this Privacy Policy. I bet it’s exactly the same as the Twitter Privacy Policy.

Neha Tiwari Oh, and – yes.

John C. Dvorak Well you know if his terms of service require that users of this website accept the worm then I think he can get around the felony thing with the terms of service, based on way case law has been going in the States…

Leo Laporte No.

John C. Dvorak …in particular.

Leo Laporte ‘When you use the site, you accept the installation of software on your system to perform any deed whatsoever, click here.’ Really, you think you could waive?

John C. Dvorak I think you can – the way it’s being done, I mean, the way they say, well, you know, the shrinkwrap law, the terms of service and all this other stuff the courts upholded.

Leo Laporte Yes.

John C. Dvorak So, the question is, well, what if you put it in the terms of service that you’re just going to hack people? So ‘if you use this website, we are allowed to take your credit card number.’ Why not?

Leo Laporte Yes, we could do anything we want to you. Wow. Do you think he’s that smart that he might have written that in?

John C. Dvorak I am always waiting for somebody to do that. I haven’t seen it yet, maybe.

Leo Laporte Interesting, I think, that the courts would say, well nice try, but, let me see, let me just see..

Neha Tiwari Yes, he’d probably play up the whole, I am a kid thing. ‘I was just a kid, it’s a harmless worm.’

Leo Laporte ‘I am a kid, I am 17, what are you going to do?

Neha Tiwari All you have to do is change your password. I didn’t do any real harm.

Leo Laporte Let’s see, first paragraph:

‘Twitter provides its Privacy Policy to inform users of our policies and procedures. Regarding the collection used to disclose your personally identifiable information.’

StalkDaily’s privacy policy:

‘StalkDaily provides its privacy policy to inform users of our policies and procedures regarding the collection use and disclosure of…’ it’s the same! He just did a search and replace on Twitter.

Neha Tiwari Yes.

Leo Laporte This site is not directed to persons under 13. I would, it would be really great if we can find in here clauses that says ‘and by the way, we put a worm on your system. By the way…’

Neha Tiwari ‘You’ve been hacked.’

Leo Laporte ‘…you’ve been hacked.’ It’s exactly the same. It’s pretty, that’s pretty bold of Mikeyy.

Neha Tiwari It is.

Leo Laporte Mikeyy has a weak grasp of jurisprudence, but he is a bold young man.

John C. Dvorak Yes, but no one’s knocked at the door.

Leo Laporte Well, we don’t know that, he might be in custody as we speak.

John C. Dvorak I am pretty sure he didn’t. We can guess.

Neha Tiwari Yes, we don’t, we don’t quite know where the fate of Mikeyy Mooney lays.

Leo Laporte Jackson Pollock, not his real name, says in our Facebook page; ‘it's standard phising. did it in high school and got everybody's itslearning accounts. Basically just edit all the /dir/dir/ to in the code and implement it. Change the user and password boxes scripts to save input and then redirect to’, it’s easy.

John C. Dvorak Your voice. This voice of yours, it’s bad.

Leo Laporte That’s my nerdy, that’s your real name, Jackson? All right, he says that’s his real name.

John C. Dvorak Jackson Pollock?

Leo Laporte Yes. Didn’t know the painter was also a hacker. It’s amazing what you learn on TWiT these days. What would you like, a little cup of coffee, some, some, anything?

Neha Tiwari No, I am good.

Leo Laporte Anything we can do for you here?

Neha Tiwari Oh, thank you.

Leo Laporte See, John if you were here…

Neha Tiwari I can hear now.

Leo Laporte The headphones, oh, I didn’t know you couldn’t hear. The headphones are actually not connected to anything, but you can listen all you want.

Neha Tiwari I couldn’t hear very well, and – yes.

Leo Laporte Are you hearing anything?

John C. Dvorak Those headphones are terrible.

Leo Laporte Are you hearing anything?

Neha Tiwari I can’t hear anything.

Leo Laporte No, they’re not connected to anything. They’re over there for a reason, just tell me if you can’t hear and I’ll turn them up.

Neha Tiwari If you could just put them up than I can probably hear better.

Leo Laporte I didn’t know you couldn’t hear.

Neha Tiwari Yeah, it’s a little hard for me to hear the boys on the phone.

Leo Laporte Oh, I am so sorry.

Neha Tiwari Man on the phone, rather.

Leo Laporte Boys to men. Can you hear them now? They are being very quiet. How’s that Sancerre?

Neha Tiwari Hey, guys? Speak.

John C. Dvorak Hello, hello.

Leo Laporte That was weird. John spoke but Wil’s mouth moved. I am very confused now. Wil I think you are muted.

Neha Tiwari Yeah, he is.

Wil Harris No – just this connection stinks.

Leo Laporte Both of your connections aren’t too good. You know what’s ironic is you are using our…

John C. Dvorak I’m 15 up.

Leo Laporte I know, I don’t understand it because, you are breaking up a little bit too. And you are on our very fancy new Ethernet in the first mile connection.

Wil Harris Wow, really, you have Ethernet in the first mile?

Leo Laporte Yeah.

John C. Dvorak He has always got these new things...

Wil Harris That’s mental.

John C. Dvorak Every week it’s something new.

Leo Laporte It is mental. But you see with Skypeasaurus – you don’t know about Skypeasaurus, Wil – we have four different computers, each running their own instance of Skype. And so we can we have – each one has his own video, so we can see all the video and than we got Ethernet in the first mile, 9 megabits up and down, true actual rock solid. It’s like …

Wil Harris That’s almost like being back in college. I remember being in college and I had 100 meg in my room.

Leo Laporte Oh man!

Wil Harris And you could get 100 meg up and down the academic network in the U.K. I remember getting like the entire Open Office disk ISO in about 45 seconds. It was awesome.

Leo Laporte [37:42] Front page of the Wall Street Journal on Saturday, Steve Jobs maintains grip at Apple.

Neha Tiwari That headline sounds like so evil.

Leo Laporte It doesn’t – it sounds like ‘he is not losing his grip.’

Wil Harris Well immediately it sounds like Darth Vader, doesn’t it? When you hear like ‘holding your grip’, you immediately think of like ‘I have you now’.

Neha Tiwari Yes, it’s like evil sounding and it’s like he is a sith lord and he has hold of Apple still, you know.

Wil Harris It is not ‘not maintain control’, it’s not ‘maintains influence’, it’s not ‘continues to brand’, it’s ‘holds grip’.

Neha Tiwari Yeah. You just see the fist.

Wil Harris And I thought Microsoft was the evil empire.

Leo Laporte They say – insiders say that Jobs is still running the show, that the board is in direct contact with Jobs and his doctors. That they all anticipate Steve will come back at the end of June. John, do you find that credible?

John C. Dvorak No.

Leo Laporte But I do, only because if they said that and it didn’t happen, wouldn’t – we have talked about this before, but wouldn’t that be kind of bad?

John C. Dvorak I am sure that their lawyers – let’s say that this is not, this is not accurate.

Wil Harris 100% accurate.

Leo Laporte What if it’s disinformation?

John C. Dvorak I would suspect that the lawyers have been consulted before they say anything about anything, I would think.

Leo Laporte And wouldn’t the lawyers say, well to avoid exposure you should only tell the truth?

Wil Harris Well you say that but how often have they told the truth about this whole...

John C. Dvorak I don’t know if that’s harsh, maybe they are telling the truth.

Neha Tiwari It’s a good gimmick.

Leo Laporte Well, that’s what I am saying.

Neha Tiwari Well, for now, because it’s a prediction.

John C. Dvorak Well do you have the exact comment that we can look at?

Leo Laporte Yeah, yeah, you want me to read the – this is the, you know what, maybe we could parse the quote. Maybe that’s the issue, maybe it’s a question of getting the exact right sentence. So, let me, let me pull up the Wall Street Journal. I hate it when they make me want to log in.

Neha Tiwari I think its actually really strategic for them to publish something like this.

Leo Laporte Even if it –

Neha Tiwari Even if its not true, because if something happens or let’s say if his health fails further, then it’s not like someone going to say ‘but you said, but you said you were going to come back and that’s why I invested more money in your stock.’

Leo Laporte Well that’s – the risk is that a stockholder lawsuit, if they say he is going to come back and the stockholders – you know, Apple’s stock is going up.

Neha Tiwari Right. But it did take a hit when he was stepping down.

Leo Laporte Well, but there, yeah but it is back like quite a bit, in fact since December Apple stock is up considerably, oddly enough.

Neha Tiwari They are trying to ride that wave but just like fuelling the fire with the smears, you know? I am not saying Apple is like evil, don’t get me wrong, but…

Leo Laporte It seems like that would be a very risky thing to do. I am sorry, I am still trying to pull up this article, the Wall – I subscribe; I actually pay for The Wall Street Journal and I have a log in and I can read this article in full, but it always wants me to log in again and I don’t remember my password and it’s just a pain in the tuckus. You know what’s weird? If you do a Google news search for these stories. Google has a link to the full story of The Wall Street Journal.

Neha Tiwari Yeah, it’s like a weird loophole. I have noticed that too.

Leo Laporte I just don’t understand it. So, let me go through Google news. VentureBeat is saying – well, I guess they are echoing The Wall Street Journal. Let’s look at The Wall Street Journal. It may be that, you might be right John if you parse it carefully, they may not be saying anything. Mr. Jobs didn’t respond to requests for comment, Apple spokesman, Steve Dowling said “Steve continues to look forward to returning to Apple at the end of June.”

Wil Harris Which makes absolutely no guarantees that he will.

Leo Laporte He is just looking forward to it.

Neha Tiwari I think it’s very carefully worded.

Leo Laporte Alright, let’s see what the other quotes are. Phil Shiller says “we are just trying to do what we do every day”. That doesn’t say anything, does it? Maybe the Journal – yeah, that’s really noncommittal.

Neha Tiwari That’s informative.

Wil Harris It is probably one of those things that is designed to sound reassuring without actually giving any reassurance.

Leo Laporte Now, they are quoting insiders also who say that Jobs has still – is closely involved in key aspects of running the company.

Wil Harris Insiders who are not named and therefore could not possibly be liable in court?

Leo Laporte Unnamed insiders. I am trying to find – there is a quote in here that are in touch with his doctors, let me just see if I can find that.

Neha Tiwari Very likely that they are working with his doctor.

Leo Laporte They are in constant touch.

Neha Tiwari They are in constant touch.

Leo Laporte Here it is, people familiar with Apple’s operation – so again unnamed, say they still expect to see Mr. Jobs return in June. Some of these people also say members of Apple’s Board of Directors are monitoring the situation directly, communicating regularly with Mr. Jobs’ physicians. The author of this article is Yukari Iwatani Kane. I think the Journal has pretty good reporters but do you think that Kane got suckered by Apple insiders?

Wil Harris Well, it wouldn’t be the first time Apple has rolled out unnamed insiders to not confirm or not deny any rumor that may or may not be the case. I mean we have had so many cases where – the famously, whatchamacallit, Goldman on CBS Tech Check.

Leo Laporte Oh, Jim Goldman just got completely – and we know Jim, Jim worked at TechTV as our business reporter and I have to be honest with you, he always had a fondness for the public relations report, the press release. I don’t know how to put this, he kind of had a fondness for that.

Neha Tiwari Yeah. Feeding off the press release. Which is not very good.

Wil Harris Talking about talks which might not be talks, which might not be reassuring, did you see that allegedly the Yahoo! CEO Carol Bartz and Steve Ballmer had a face to face this week to discuss possible search partnerships?

Leo Laporte Yeah, once again they are doing that.

Wil Harris According to sources closest to Yahoo!, the discussions are not about acquisition but are about some kind of partnership that will involve Microsoft taking all the value in Yahoo! without actually paying any money for it.

Leo Laporte Is that your quote or is that actually…

Wil Harris No, I made the last bit up.

Leo Laporte I like that. That might be the most honest quote I have heard.

Wil Harris Well, why buy the company when you can do a search partnership which is all you really want anyway?

Neha Tiwari That’s actually very smart. You are getting what you want, you’re noy –

Leo Laporte But actually what they really wanted was the ad network, wasn’t it? Wasn’t the ad network what they really wanted?

Wil Harris Same thing, search and ads are the same thing these days.

Leo Laporte Oh, they are?

Wil Harris Absolutely. What’s the point of a search without ads? What’s the point of ads without search, you might argue.

Leo Laporte I don’t know. Search, you are looking for something?

Wil Harris Yeah, but the only way to monetize the search is with an ad.

Leo Laporte So, if they did a – okay, well I am just saying that when you say a search deal like Yahoo! for a while had a search deal with Google where it was Google search, it wasn’t Google ads. So, you are saying if they are saying a search deal they mean a search and ads deal.

Wil Harris Yeah, that’s the only way you’d ever make any money, otherwise you would just be paying money to get people to search using your search engine which I can’t see would be that interesting. I don’t know.

John C. Dvorak I don’t know.

Leo Laporte I don’t know either. This is the story; this is the vampire of text stories, it just will not –

John C. Dvorak Well, this is the – the next one developing is the IBM/Sun story.

Leo Laporte I thought that was dead.

John C. Dvorak Well, now they are, you know, now they are wondering whether McNealy’s going to come back and take over the company and things like that.

Leo Laporte So, the story was that McNealy wanted to sell to – no, no Schwartz wanted to sell to IBM, McNealy did not.

John C. Dvorak Right, because it’s his baby.

Leo Laporte And Schwartz, who is current CEO realized the writing was on the wall and said let’s take the money and run. So, you think Scott McNealy will kick Jonathan Schwartz out and take the company back?

John C. Dvorak That’s what a lot of people think.

Leo Laporte Interesting. Now, this is very similar isn’t it to the Yahoo! deal where Jerry Yang did not want to sell; founder’s remorse.

John C. Dvorak Right, yeah.

Wil Harris And as CEO when you are pushing hard for a sale –

John C. Dvorak This gets us into the opposite situation because if you got the guy who did want to sell being – no matter what you do you can’t win.

Leo Laporte Yeah, yeah.

Wil Harris It is hard to be tenable as a CEO when you are pushing really hard for a sale and then the sale doesn’t happen. It is like “we are going to be fine anyway” and it is like, well if you were going to be fine anyway, why are you pushing for a sale so hard.

Leo Laporte We haven’t heard a lot from Carol Bartz. This must be her first – this is her first action going to talk to Steve Ballmer. They probably know each other from the good old days. Let’s take a break. We are going to come back and talk about the Palm Pre. Rumor has it, it might be coming sooner than later, which would be a very good thing not just for the Palm but for people who are trying to decide, well should I get an iPhone or should I get an Palm Pre. We can expect a new iPhone in June, what should the timing be for the iPhone killer from Palm?

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And it comes with – now I don’t want to say blogs because it’s not just blogs. It has a blog module which by the way supports import and export for WordPress for Blogger for Movable Type and for TypePad, so your data isn’t locked in. It’s easy to move in and easy to move out should you choose. There is a forum, great forum software. Imagine your website, you can have all of this functionality, photo gallery, a forum builder, there is Google maps integration, there is Disqus integration. I use Disqus as my commenting system. That was my concern when we were talking about moving over. I said yeah, I’d love to move over, I like everything but I want to use my – I want to continue to use my Disqus comment system. They said no problem. One line of JavaScript; it’s easy.

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So, article in which was for a long time a great site for kind of information about ripping DVDs and so forth. They are saying it may be out, the Palm Pre may be out in May. According to Brighthands, Sprint employees have been granted no vacation time in the month of May. This is that same story that we heard at AT&T when the iPhones come out. The expected release date; May 17th, May 17th. That would be very interesting, and an interesting strategy too because I think everybody agrees that in the June timeframe you are going to see a new iPhone. Which is better for Palm? Is it better to release the Pre before or after Apple updates its iPhone? Everybody is very interested in what Apple’s going to do with the third generation iPhone. That 3.0 software is very popular. Wil, Wil are you still using your iPhone?

Wil Harris Oh, I never put down it down. It’s one of the things where you kind of – you don’t realize how you could possibly have lived your life before it actually happened, before you got the iPhone like how did you manage to work or exist. So yeah I still use it. I think, you know, the Palm Pre is going to have it hard, because it will have a really nice big market splash in, I think, May is looking like a pretty likely timeframe from what I know, and then it just going to get – I don’t want to say it’s going to get blown away in June by the new iPhone, but Apple’s going to have, I think, probably something pretty compelling for the new iPhone in June. And so the Pre might have a really nice window. It’s probably better for the Pre to come before the new iPhone, I would say rather than after the new iPhone because there is every chance that it could, you know it could be dead before it’s alive in that case.

Leo Laporte Well, let me think about this. Now of course there are other iPhone killers, there was the BlackBerry Storm which was terrible, terrible. And the Samsung Instinct; terrible. So, is it better for them, I don’t know. I think you probably want to come out before the iPhone, I think you are right. What about, Neha are you an iPhone user?

Neha Tiwari I am not. I use...

Leo Laporte You are BlackBerry.

Neha Tiwari I am a BlackBerry Pearl user.

Leo Laporte It comes down to that, doesn’t it? It’s BlackBerry or iPhone. Those are the choices.

Neha Tiwari It really is and I have been using it for a long time. I had a job a little while ago where they gave me an iPhone to use. So I used it for a couple of months and I liked it. I was originally very anti-iPhone because it’s like you go out in a social situation and everyone just has their iPhone out and it’s like this weird –

Leo Laporte Well, that’s why I am anti-Twitter because it’s kind of – that you know they are all twittering. That’s what they are doing.

Neha Tiwari It’s, I mean it’s a little annoying, I’m sorry I –

Leo Laporte It’s very annoying.

Neha Tiwari I just think it kind of takes out the fun of actually talking.

Leo Laporte But people do that with BlackBerries too. You can’t deny that.

Neha Tiwari Okay, yeah I know and I Twitter, I tweet from my BlackBerry as well and stuff like that.

Leo Laporte Yeah, so there you go. So, that’s just as annoying.

Neha Tiwari So I understand that but I am curious, like I wonder do you think that some people who may have resisted the iPhone like maybe really anti-Apple PC people, do you think that they may really go for the Pre versus –

Leo Laporte I am really interested in the Pre. I would love to if it...

Neha Tiwari I would love to too and I think it just looks really simplistic and...

John C. Dvorak I thought I was called the prē, I’m sorry.

Leo Laporte Is it prē? I don’t think you’d name it prē.

Neha Tiwari There is the line over the e. So...

Leo Laporte It’s Pre.

Neha Tiwari There is a line over the e. So, I think it’s long e.

Leo Laporte John, why would you, if your company is going down and this was your last, best hope…

John C. Dvorak Well, it’s pre-bankruptcy, right? “Pre” bankruptcy or “prē” for help, one of the two. Why would name the thing either one of those?

Leo Laporte Both of them suck, but prē...

Neha Tiwari Yeah, it’s not the greatest name.

Leo Laporte prē must be – is a, I think marginally worse.

John C. Dvorak prē. Mmm.

Leo Laporte prē. We pray that it saves the company.

Neha Tiwari We pray that it will – but I think – as far as design and everything just from the gallery and things that you can just tell on a very superficial level it looks nice enough. I like that it’s kind of a slider phone too. I like that.

Leo Laporte Yeah. Well, it’s got a nice touch screen. You still get a keyboard.

Neha Tiwari Yeah. I think you said something that, I mean, do you have an iPhone? Of course, you do. Do you miss having a keyboard?

Leo Laporte No.

Neha Tiwari Like a real tactile keyboard.

Leo Laporte I have got really – you know, when I first got it I kind of went back to the BlackBerry for a while because I really couldn’t type on the thing.

Neha Tiwari See that killed me, not having a keyboard.

Leo Laporte And you know what you have to trust in the Steve. You have to let the Steve flow through you and what happens is as you type you are typing all the wrong letters because it’s impossible because – especially with my fingers you can’t. But you just trust in the Steve and then at the end of the word you will have typed X3419L2 and it will say hello. It just knows what you meant and you just hit space and it goes on. You got to trust. You don’t trust; that’s your problem.

Neha Tiwari I don’t. I like the feeling of buttons. I am a very tactile person and I like having the buttons for keyboard. That’s why I have stayed with BlackBerry.

Leo Laporte What, John?

John C. Dvorak I am just saying, I got a message from someone the other day that believes this too, you know the “believe in the Force”. I couldn’t read it. It was just a bunch of crap. I mean it was just, it’s unreadable.

Neha Tiwari See, that’s what I am saying?

John C. Dvorak This reminds me a lot of the – what was the Newton remember that? There was a joke, you know.

Leo Laporte You remember the joke?

John C. Dvorak I wish I –, no, it’s something I don’t remember.

Leo Laporte I remember it. How many Newtons does it take to screw in a light bulb? Farm.

John C. Dvorak Right. Something like that.

Leo Laporte It was exactly that.

Wil Harris I think what so many of these sort of handset manufacturers miss is that the handset is really only three quarters the experience or half the experience. The other half of the experience is your desktop interaction and the fact that you know with MobileMe, okay, so it sucked to start with, but now you have auto updating, you know synchronizing over the air 24/7 from your computer to your phone. You’ve got all your music back and forth really, really easily. You’ve got an easy way of transferring apps and getting new apps onto it. The actual phone hardware is now such a relatively small part of the experience compared to the platform and the computer integration and I just don’t see that Palm has, like, any plan for doing that beyond some kind of open source developers tool which they haven’t made any attempt as far they can see to integrate particularly well with any platform.

Neha Tiwari I mean don’t you agree though I mean back in its day PalmPilots and stuff they did have pretty good...

Leo Laporte Oh they owned.

Neha Tiwari They owned. They were –

Leo Laporte They owned.

Neha Tiwari What’s not to say that this, too, will have great desktop integration and things like that.

John C. Dvorak Lots. Where is Jeff Hawkins when we need him?

Leo Laporte Well, true. He’s off inventing a human/machine brain interface.

John C. Dvorak And he’s the guy behind the whole thing and that’s why they rocked in their early days and...

Leo Laporte But you’ve got to say that they – what they did was smart as they went out and they got John Rubinstein and all the iPhone engineers over to do this. So a lot of the guys who were instrumental in designing the original iPhone worked on the Pre.

John C. Dvorak We will see.

Leo Laporte It will be very, I mean you know...

John C. Dvorak I’m reminded of that BlackBerry clunker that you’ve got there.

Leo Laporte Oh the Storm, what a piece of junk.

Neha Tiwari I was very disappointed by that. I just think of getting the Storm but then when I played with it, I was like, no, I think I am just going to stick with the Pearl. The Pearl’s still good.

Leo Laporte I am not a Pearl – I like the Curve but I think the Bold and the 8900 these, the newer BlackBerries –

John C. Dvorak How many phones do you have?

Wil Harris The Bold is the daddy, the Bold is by far the best BlackBerry.

Neha Tiwari How many phones do you need actually?

Leo Laporte Well, I feel like, it’s kind, you know it’s funny for a long time I really resisted the whole phone thing and I had one phone but any time I go anywhere especially because of the radio show right, anytime I go anywhere all of the radio station executives and sales people all they ever want to talk about is cell phones. And I realized, for the non-geek the cell phone is technology, right. It’s the one they’re most into, they are most aware of and so as a result I accept, I think I better know more about cell phones. And it’s turned out actually to be a – it was a good move but it does require – I have accounts with every carrier.

John C. Dvorak Oh God.

Neha Tiwari My goodness.

Leo Laporte I know it’s expensive. But look at this. Here is the Android, this is the Google, the Google phone.

John C. Dvorak I kind of like the Android just because it kind of funky.

Neha Tiwari Yeah.

Leo Laporte I like it I guess. Here it is, oh that’s where –

John C. Dvorak I thought it was sitting in the chair talking to a mike.

Leo Laporte A chair? No, it’s a giant, no and it’s – it says sorry process, android.process.acore is not responding. I mean this happens all the time. The battery life dies. I mean there is a lot to be said for it but it’s just not a reliable, I think it’s the handset. I don’t think it’s Android. I think it’s the G1. I really had high hopes for this one too.

Neha Tiwari There is a lot of hype surrounding it too when it came out. One thing I would like to know as far as the Pre is, is it as fragile as the iPhone?

Leo Laporte You think the iPhone’s fragile?

Neha Tiwari I think so.

Leo Laporte Have you broken one?

Neha Tiwari I mean I have seen so many cracked screens.

Leo Laporte My son – we did a father-son thing a couple of days ago. We jailbroke our iPhones together, it was really good, a touching moment.

John C. Dvorak Aw, that’s so sweet.

Neha Tiwari Aw, that’s precious.

Leo Laporte He says dad, I want to know how to hack. I said let’s start with jailbreaking.

John C. Dvorak Did he do it in that voice?

Leo Laporte Yeah. Dad, I want to be Mikey.

Neha Tiwari I look up to Mikey.

Leo Laporte I want – trying to site and hack Twitter and make everybody go to my site, can you help me? You know what, when he says that – my kids, both my kids say that. I say well, okay; first we got to learn Bash Shell programming and that shuts him up right away.

John C. Dvorak That would, yeah.

Neha Tiwari Yeah.

Leo Laporte Bash Shell programming… but it’s true, right? If you are going to be hacker, you got to know the Bash Shell, don’t you think?

John C. Dvorak No, you could just be a script kiddy.

Leo Laporte I don’t, no kid of mine is going to be a script kiddy. Anyway so we jailbroke it and he found immediately an application that puts cracks on your screen when you touch it, and it really looks realistic. It looked...

Neha Tiwari Totally looks broken.

Leo Laporte So he goes up to his friends and says oh dude I broke my iPhone and they all go oh man. It hurts you viscerally when you see that broken screen.

Neha Tiwari Oh it is because it’s shards of glass.

Leo Laporte Oh, it’s terrible.

Neha Tiwari It’s just so painful to see that.

Leo Laporte Oh, it’s terrible.

Neha Tiwari Yeah but I am curious if this is – if this would be...

Leo Laporte I don’t think this is that vulnerable.

Neha Tiwari If this will have a similar issue?

Leo Laporte You know a glass screen is a glass screen, you know?

Neha Tiwari Yeah exactly.

Leo Laporte Let’s see. You know I just, Jason Calacanis keeps bugging me. He is in Korea and he wants to show off his bandwidth. So maybe we will give him a jingle in a little bit.

John C. Dvorak The bandwidth in Korea is overrated.

Leo Laporte Really? Because you came back singing its praises.

John C. Dvorak No.

Leo Laporte You didn’t.

John C. Dvorak No, not really, I think I was complaining. I think they talk a big game over there. Maybe at the University or some place like that I might have some speed. But the funny thing was I had, in fact Kim Ratkowski, who took us over there, he was complaining bitterly, I have video of him complaining about it. He says it’s bogus and then just out of the blue like about six months ago, one of the guy – the network analysts over at Mevio was giving a presentation showing the various speeds on the edge. In Korea it was the worst.

Leo Laporte Well Edge is terrible. You mean they’re –

John C. Dvorak I’m talking about like at the Okami network.

Leo Laporte Oh at the edge of the network? Oh really?

John C. Dvorak Yeah, it’s there where you would have all these, you know, you’re supposed to have all this boost. And it was the worst of the, of all the countries internationally. And then of course I asked them about that and they said well, it’s possible that you know because the Koreans don’t do this or that, maybe it’s just a fake number. But I doubt that connection’s going to be that good, it should, you know…

Leo Laporte How interesting. This was like the big thing, like there, the wired, most wired nation. You know who really has a lot of bandwidth? Sweden.

John C. Dvorak Yes, Sweden does have a lot of bandwidth. That’s the first place I saw IPTV and it was years ago and it was just like cable TV. It was so good, you could click, click, click right through any channels. It was – you wouldn’t even know you weren’t on cable TV.

Leo Laporte Yeah.

John C. Dvorak Because it was 30 megs like everywhere.

Leo Laporte Many of our Swedish listeners say they’ve got 100 megs.

John C. Dvorak Yeah well it was 30 megs three years ago.

Leo Laporte Well, let’s see. I think Jason’s on the line – let me see if I can get Jason on the line here from here. I have to twist his knobs. I don’t even know which knob goes to which.

John C. Dvorak Yeah, he’d probably like that.

Leo Laporte Oh, it begins already. Jason, can you hear me? Oh, we lost his connection. I guess that great South Korean bandwidth failed us.

Wil Harris The irony, the irony.

Leo Laporte The irony… connection lost. I have no connection.

Neha Tiwari Sweden just has it all going on.

Leo Laporte [62:18] It’s funny I don’t know what happened there. Alright, moving on to yet another fascinating story. Did you see the journal article about – I guess we already kind of talked about spies in the grid. Didn’t we? That was our – we kind of talked about that peripherally at the very top of the show.

The Zune HD, there’s a good story. Well excited?

Neha Tiwari Hmm.

John C. Dvorak Oh, gosh.

Leo Laporte Alright this is a common topic for me, something I always hated. The cost of SMS messages. I once calculated that at the typical cost of $0.20 a message, 140 byte message, you’re paying $1500 a megabyte.

John C. Dvorak Seems high.

Leo Laporte Seems high.

Wil Harris You guys have such a remedial SMS system.

Leo Laporte It’s terrible. And you know the phone companies use this as a way to take advantage of us basically.

Neha Tiwari It’s true.

John C. Dvorak Mostly they take advantage of teenage girls.

Neha Tiwari Yes.

Leo Laporte Well you might be right because Dena Christoffersen of Cheyenne, Wyoming got quite a surprise in the mail the other day. She is a Wyoming 13-year-old, mom and dad thought that they had turned off text messaging on her phone and as a result they never ordered a text messaging plan. Oh, that was a big mistake.

Neha Tiwari That was a bad idea to begin with.

Leo Laporte Dena sent or received 20,000 text messages in one bill. In one billing period!

Wil Harris Over how – in one billing cycle?

Neha Tiwari Oh my God.

Leo Laporte Yes.

Neha Tiwari Did this girl speak or does she just type?

Wil Harris That means she is doing a 700 texts a day rate, more or less.

Leo Laporte Well, remember, incoming counts as well as outgoing, right?

Neha Tiwari Right.

Wil Harris Well, still.

Leo Laporte So you could subscribe to Twitter for instance and say I want all my Twitter messages to come…

Neha Tiwari That’s true, in and out.

Leo Laporte …in and out and boom, bing, bang. So you want to take a guess at what the bill was?

Wil Harris I’m going to go with roundabout $5000.

Leo Laporte Very good, bingo. Were you reading the article?

Neha Tiwari Cheater.

Leo Laporte You…

It was $4750. Her father, Gregg Christoffersen told KUSA-TV in Denver that he thought texting had been disabled on the phone. When he got the bill, he took a hammer and smashed the phone into pieces.

Neha Tiwari That’s discipline.

Leo Laporte Dena will text no more. But I don’t blame Dena on this. I blame Verizon.

Neha Tiwari Well, actually I blame her parents for taking off text messaging altogether. That wasn’t…

Leo Laporte That was dumb, wasn’t it?

Neha Tiwari …that was just a bad idea. If your child has a text messaging problem…

Leo Laporte Do you text a lot?

Neha Tiwari I do.

Leo Laporte How much?

Neha Tiwari Not $5000 worth.

Leo Laporte Not 20,000 messages?

Neha Tiwari No, and I Twitter like everything. No, I don’t think I text that much. And even – but you know who does text a lot are Indian people in India. Everyone is – it’s all about SMSing there. There is no voicemail in India.

Leo Laporte The Brits too right? Everybody texts.

John C. Dvorak Well, actually college kids in this country too.

Wil Harris We absolutely text like crazy, which I think is because we –

Neha Tiwari You have voicemail – there’s voicemail in the UK though, right?

Wil Harris Yeah, everybody uses voicemail but most people will interact with SMS and it is because it doesn’t cost you anything to receive an SMS over here.

Neha Tiwari Oh, I see. See I think it’s the same.

Wil Harris You can – and most, you practically can’t buy, you can’t buy a voice plan these days that doesn’t come with messages built in. so you really, really struggle to spend a lot of money on texting. I mean the iPhone comes with like, I don’t know 1000 messages a month or something just as part of the plan.

Leo Laporte I paid the 20 bucks a month for unlimited texting, so I use it whenever I can.

Neha Tiwari Right.

John C. Dvorak Leo, Leo, Leo…

Leo Laporte What?

John C. Dvorak You don’t text, you don’t answer email, you don’t do anything. You just sit there and broadcast.

Leo Laporte Like a spider in my web!

Wil Harris Yeah he says whenever he can, which is like once a day.

Leo Laporte No, actually I do – I use text messaging. I text my kids and stuff. Kids really do, you’re right, John, college kids and even teenagers in the US have discovered texting. For a long time they did not text.

Neha Tiwari They love texting. Even when I was in college it wasn’t that…and that was about…

Leo Laporte It’s come on strongly.

Neha Tiwari Now I think it’s huge. Back then it wasn’t as big the whole SMS thing.

Leo Laporte Yeah, well I, believe me, I paid for unlimited for Henry. Abbey told me, she is in France right now and she says because it’s so expensive to make a cellphone call, nobody makes calls, they text. That’s all they do.

Neha Tiwari Yeah, I found this in India too. I mean I had a cellphone there and it was…

Leo Laporte Is it pricey to make a call?

Neha Tiwari It is. I mean it can be if you’re roaming or if you’re making an out-of-state call. It can be pricey. It’s actually cheaper to just SMS somebody or have them call you or something like that. But there is no voicemail in India so SMS is like the way to leave a message…

Leo Laporte I don’t get that. You mean you can’t leave a message?

Neha Tiwari No, there is no voicemail.

John C. Dvorak On landlines either? Do people have answering machines?

Neha Tiwari I am not sure about landlines. Most people there – I mean, most people that I knew there have mobiles.

Leo Laporte They don’t have landlines.

Neha Tiwari Not really.

John C. Dvorak Really. That’s interesting. I thought they would have…

Neha Tiwari Some people do but the mobile phone is much more common. Like everyone, everybody down to like my teeny tiny nieces and nephews also have cellphones there.

Leo Laporte Wow, that’s wild.

John C. Dvorak You know, I think, the one thing about texting that’s interesting, is really a very efficient way to communicate. You know you have the text – nobody wants to crank out long messages, especially if they don’t have a keyboard. And they – but if you do have a keyboard, you don’t want to just keep typing and typing. So it’s just really, I think you set up an appointment, you go to meet somebody and just real quick and easy and I think it’s an outstanding way to communicate.

Leo Laporte Well, that’s exactly why I use it. I prefer it to – you know, Kevin Rose, mentioned a few weeks ago on the show that he is now sending out with all of his emails this thing from And it says I only answer in three lines all my email. It is the same idea, it’s like if 140 characters is enough for text, that’s all you’re getting from me. And he says it saves him a lot of time. I couldn’t really do that, but texting is great in terms of efficiency…

Neha Tiwari I couldn’t really do that. It is.

Wil Harris The best hack that I found for that was that you know if you’re sending an email from a mobile device, most people are quite happy for the fact it can be punctuated badly, it’s going to be short and it’s going to be curt. So someone suggested to me that you just put on your desktop client as your signature, sent from BlackBerry, or sent from iPhone. And then you can just sent one line replies to everything and nobody will ever –

John C. Dvorak I thought about that too. I thought, because I said, why don’t I just put that on there as my signature, because then I don’t have to worry about the misspellings, you know with that...

Neha Tiwari But doesn’t it still bother you? It still bothers me whenever I get like a really weird SMS or –

Leo Laporte At least they have a reason.

Neha Tiwari But still, it still bothers me like I don’t like some people over-abbreviate things. Like, it still bothers me.

Leo Laporte You know what bothers me?

John C. Dvorak Like “you”, just the letter “U”, “R”…

Neha Tiwari Yeah, and then they just start taking out vowels and it’s just V’s and I just don’t even know what’s going on.

Leo Laporte How old are you, Neha? You sound like an old – ‘when I was a kid we used the whole word’. Kids today!

Neha Tiwari I know I sound like a complaining old lady but really I can’t handle it. It just, it’s really, it hurts my eyes to read.

Leo Laporte Sure old fashioned for such a young person.

Neha Tiwari I guess so.

Leo Laporte I rarely use vowels anymore.

Neha Tiwari Really?

John C. Dvorak I always say ‘you’ with, “u” “r” “2”. Number 2.

Neha Tiwari Well you and like all marketing people with products.

Leo Laporte Do you remember, John, who was it? Somebody we worked for at Ziff Davis, he was a young, hot executive. He and his wife worked there and they ended up in New Mexico, Arizona. What was his name?

John C. Dvorak Ronnie Sonnenberg and Jeff Ballou.

Leo Laporte Jeff Ballou. Jeff Ballou, to prove how, what a busy executive he was, would never punctuate, never uppercase, all his emails were all lowercase with no periods and that bugged the hell out of me, because I knew that was a pose. That was like ‘I’m busy. I don’t have time to punctuate.’

Neha Tiwari Yeah, I just put them together.

John C. Dvorak Actually Bill Gates, I think, sometimes would do...

Leo Laporte Bill Gates does that?

John C. Dvorak Yeah, I think, Ballmer – last time I got a note from him. It was kind of similar.

Leo Laporte I don’t like that.

Neha Tiwari I don’t either.

Leo Laporte I don’t like that at all.

Neha Tiwari If you don’t have time to send me a message then just don’t send it to me.

Leo Laporte ‘If you don’t have time to spell it properly don’t spell it at all. I want the commas where they belong. And please there’s a difference between it’s with an apostrophe and its without.’

Neha Tiwari Keep your thoughts to yourself.

Leo Laporte We’ve got grammar girl Neha Tiwari with us today.

Neha Tiwari It’s annoying, it hurts my eyes. Like I’ve deleted messages with them in.

Leo Laporte My eyes!

John C. Dvorak My eyes!

Neha Tiwari And it’s like forget it. I am not reading this. This is garbage.

Leo Laporte You wouldn’t like my kids. In fact, one of the reasons – Abby is very smart, but one of the reasons she didn’t do so well in her – she got a 750 on her SAT Verbal but she got –

John C. Dvorak I’m glad the whole world knows

Leo Laporte I am proud of that. That’s a good number.

Neha Tiwari It’s very good.

Leo Laporte But like a 590 on the Written because she doesn’t punctuate or spell. Because she doesn’t know how. But I kind of blame this, and I may be wrong but I blame this on the –

John C. Dvorak The schools.

Leo Laporte Yeah. There was a fad called whole language. Do you remember that fad?

Neha Tiwari Whole language?

John C. Dvorak No.

Leo Laporte Where they got kids writing like in Second Grade very early and they said…

John C. Dvorak Oh, I vaguely remember this.

Leo Laporte …don’t pay attention to spelling. Don’t pay attention to punctuation.

Neha Tiwari Is this like Montessori school stuff?

Leo Laporte Kind of Montessori. It was a little bit – but you know they taught it in the public schools. It was like, it was a little touchy feels, like oh no, we just want them to write. They don’t have to worry about – and so she never studied phonetics. They didn’t study phonetics and they didn’t do any of that stuff. And as a result that’s how she writes; without punctuation and spelling. I think it was a mistake. She was a –

John C. Dvorak All these experimental things turn out to be mistakes.

Leo Laporte I think you’re right.

Neha Tiwari Or you know it could be spellcheck, that’s ruining the youth.

Leo Laporte Well, that’s one of the things she says is that well, they didn’t have spellcheck at the SATs, what was I supposed to do?

Neha Tiwari My mom used to say that when I used to do Math was ‘oh, you people with your calculators, you’ll never learn math.’

Leo Laporte What did she learn, on an abacus? What did she use?

Neha Tiwari No, but I guess well, because she was raised in India and I guess they’re really big on teaching you like your multiplication tables to like 50. And she can like calculate and compute things in her head that are amazing. Like she’s just like a Math whiz.

Leo Laporte [72:31] Big article actually in the Times today about Google. This is that same article we’ve seen over and over again from the Tech sector saying we need more H1B visas. There are people in America, kids are not getting well educated. We need more students from India in particular, China to be able to come here to college and then we don’t let them come here to work. And Google said we could hire, we could get the engineers we need but they won’t let us, they won’t give us visas. And they highlighted one Google engineer who did have a visa to work in the United States but his wife – they’re both Indian nationals. His wife did not. So they live in Canada, because he can’t work here. In the Google maps division, he works out at the Google sales office in Vancouver.

Neha Tiwari I tell you, something interesting when I was in Delhi, we had to develop some paperwork at the consulate there and it was interesting because you know you see lines for every country there. The longest line was for the United States. I mean they had the UK, they had all kinds of random countries. They are all in the same area, but the very longest line was for the United States.

Leo Laporte People want to come here, they want to study.

Neha Tiwari They want to come here. Everyone in the line was very young I would say.

Leo Laporte I think it’s interesting because we do have a, I think a crappy secondary school system. We have a very good college system. We probably have the best university system in the world. Oddly enough, I don’t know how that happened. So kids they go to school in India, they learn their math, they do the 50, and –

Neha Tiwari With the abacus.

Leo Laporte And then they go to college in the States. But they are not allowed to stay here and work and I think that that’s a shame.

Neha Tiwari I have a cousin who is actually doing that, he is doing his Masters in Engineering at the University of Florida. And he is very smart, but he can’t stay here after he has done with it.

Leo Laporte A Professor of Physics at the University of Toronto says very succinctly ‘private wealth, public squalor.’ I guess that’s true, although you went to the University of California which is a very good public school, state run school. One of the best schools in the country.

Neha Tiwari Yeah. I loved it there. And I felt like – I felt that education was quite good and I had a lot of friends who were in the EECS program or the electric engineering, computer science program, very competitive.

Leo Laporte You’re a Cal fan, right John?

John C. Dvorak I went to Cal too.

Leo Laporte Yeah

Neha Tiwari Oh right.

John C. Dvorak I got my degree in History. I got bailed out of the engineering side of things. I couldn’t handle it. And they’re not –

Neha Tiwari It’s very competitive.

John C. Dvorak Oh, it’s too competitive for me.

Neha Tiwari It’s very hard. I don’t know.

Leo Laporte Was it like that in the 50s when you went there?

John C. Dvorak It’s all those Asians with no social life. They come over here and boom, they just kick your ass. What are you are supposed to do?

Leo Laporte You were there in the late ‘60s, mid ‘60s?

John C. Dvorak I was there back in the ‘20s, they were just building the school back when I went.

Leo Laporte Were there a lot of Asian students there when you went there?

John C. Dvorak It was all – engineering was all Asian, all from China. And they just basically worked all day and worked all night, they never went out, they never went on dates, they never showed up at parties, they never did anything except work and study, work and study, work and study, going back to China, and the next thing we’re like getting Ds and they are marching off.

Neha Tiwari There were still many students even in my day, when I was there, there was a lot of that as well, foreign students.

Leo Laporte I think it’s worse now I thought. I was actually surprised to hear it was that way even back in the dark ages.

Neha Tiwari Yes, I didn’t know that either.

John C. Dvorak Oh, yes, always, now it’s actually more Asian because they’ve got sick of the white kids coming in there and then causing riots.

Leo Laporte Let me, let me, I am going to pose a question and then I am going to take a break, but the question – you may baste your lamb, your leg of lamb, John, but the question I am going to pose you is, well, if you were going to graduate school today and you had your choice of anything you would like to study, what would be the number one, the fastest growing graduate school profession, the one that has the best future? This is going to shock you.

We’ll talk about it in just a second but first I want to mention my friends at GoToMyPC, these are folks at Citrix. GoToMyPC is a very, very cool remote access program. It’s really, as far as I am concerned, the best remote access out there, It has to be. There are free choices. I know there are free choices out there for you for remote access. So, how does somebody create a product that you pay for by making it easier to use, by making it faster, by making it work on any computer, anywhere and absolutely securely? There’ve been a lot of remote-access exploits you might have read about in the last few months, not GoToMyPC. These guys know what they are doing. It is totally secure, 128 bit SSL encryption. The beauty of GoToMyPC is complete net reversal, you go to – the way it works is you – if you can do it right now, go to, that’s the website, and for free you can sign up for 30 days. Now here’s the beauty, it takes a couple of minutes of sign up, you’ll notice immediately, I didn’t have to configure the router, I don’t have to open ports? No, you may for the other guys. You don’t, because it’s using full net traversal.

Now, anywhere you go, anywhere you can get online whether it’s at home, you go home early, whether it’s an internet café, even a sketch internet café in India at Agra, whether it’s airport or a hotel, you log on to, you’re having a 128 bit SSL encrypted connection. They pass you on to your office computer. You are now point to point encrypted to your office computer. You could do anything you would do if you were sitting there, you see it full screen, so you can send and receive emails, run programs, access resources. It’s effectively a VPN, by the way you could surf the net too completely securely even in the most sketch of places. PC World gave it their World Class Award for Best Remote-Access Software, it’s that good.

If you – sometimes people worry about security in new technologies. If you’ve been worried, maybe some of the examples they’re using is online banking. It took people a while to feel like it was safe to do that. If you’ve been worried about that, let me tell you the security on GoToMyPC is the best you can get and Citrix knows this stuff. Fast, easy, secure, it’s a simple pitch, it want you to try it for free for 30 days. Go to and try it absolutely free.

[79:04] So, newspapers are going under, magazines going under, the blogger – it’s the age of the blogger. So, according to the Pew Research Center, 5,000 newspaper jobs gone in 2008, since 2001 more than 10,000 journalists out of work, 47,000 unemployed and yet journalism programs cannot, cannot make enough room for new journalism students.

Columbia, Stanford and NYU applications up 38%, 20% and 6% respectively from the previous year, University of Colorado up 11%, University of North Carolina up 14%, Maryland up 25%. What’s going on? People are spending – the average price for graduate school, including living expense, is $31,000 a year. The best they can hope for, getting a job, 40,000 a year as a journalist, and there aren’t that many jobs. What are they thinking? Would you go to J-School Today? Neha, did you, what did you study in college?

Neha Tiwari I have a confession to make.

Leo Laporte What?

Neha Tiwari I actually applied to grad school.

Leo Laporte For Journalism?

Neha Tiwari For Journalism.

John C. Dvorak For J school – to do at Berkeley?

Neha Tiwari Yup.

Leo Laporte Why?

Neha Tiwari And I practically was like, I was basically wait listed, and they told me to reapply next term.

Leo Laporte Because it was over sold.

Neha Tiwari Yes, and, but you know what, now I am kind of like, what was I thinking, do I really want to be that much in debt two years from now? Like, do I seriously, I mean why would I, why did I even make that decision, and again I think grad school is a great thing, and, I think I did it because at that time I felt like that will be the right thing to do, but I’m not shocked, I think what’s happening here is, I think a lot of people feel like, okay I don’t know what I am doing, I am a good journalist, or I am, whatever, a blogger…

Leo Laporte You think it’s bloggers who do this, who say I just want to get a…

Neha Tiwari I think so, I think, well okay, well I need more cred so I can go to J-School, buy me some cred…

Leo Laporte At 31,000 a year.

Neha Tiwari At 31,000, be in debt that I will never pay off with my 45K job that I get out of grad school, but I couldn’t tell you what I, what personally I was thinking when I decided to apply to J-School I think.

Leo Laporte I mean, I think it’s, I’d love to see bloggers and online journalists have that training, I guess, why John, what do you think, what’s going on here?

Neha Tiwari Yes, I don’t know if…

John C. Dvorak I have taught at Cal over the – not as a professor, but as a guest lecturer when Markoff and Gregg Zachary were teaching at Cal and of course then they began teaching at Stanford and it’s interesting because the students that come through there are kind of generational. Every group is different. But I don’t know what the value of it would be to a blogger. I mean, I think, that you couldn’t get elsewhere. And the other thing is like there’s nothing like on the job training, I mean taking a bunch of graduate courses in journalism is different than getting a job at a newspaper or someplace where you actually have people yelling at you.

Neha Tiwari That’s true.

Leo Laporte That’s a good point.

Neha Tiwari That’s a very good point. There is more patience.

Leo Laporte That’s like going to the Columbia School of Broadcasting and then becoming a DJ, there’s not…

John C. Dvorak Yes, or you can actually even the Paul Allen School of Broadcasting is more valuable generally, because you are on the air for years

Leo Laporte Yes, actually that’s where I got my degree, at the Paul Allen School of Broadcasting.

John C. Dvorak I don’t know, I was just saying that nothing works like experience, especially when it comes to writing, the more you…

Leo Laporte And is J-School, I mean, is that going to count in any way?

John C. Dvorak I don’t think it’s going to do you any good at this point.

Leo Laporte What about ethics? What about learning kind of the collected wisdom of journalists over the year? Isn’t there something to be gained?

Neha Tiwari They teach you that in undergrad too, I mean, one of my core classes in my Mass Com major was an ethics course.

Leo Laporte I am glad to hear that, I mean that’s one thing you can say bloggers don’t have.

Neha Tiwari That’s true.

John C. Dvorak I would think that undergraduate journalism, I don’t know what the point of the graduate school is, I mean, under graduate – one or two courses in journalism, as an undergrad, and working on the school paper, you can always get, I mean, I wrote for the Daily Cal and, is really all you really need from then on, you can just either pick it up on the job or whatever, I don’t, the problem is that in the United States everybody wants to think of Journalism as a profession whereas in most of the rest of the world, and England in particular, it’s thought of as a trade.

Leo Laporte Trade.

Neha Tiwari Yes, that’s true.

Leo Laporte I am a brick layer.

John C. Dvorak And it’s like, yes, that’s what it is, it’s not rocket science, and I don’t think you have to be a genius to be a writer…

Leo Laporte I think it is a trade.

John C. Dvorak …it’s kind of a dumb job, I mean –

Neha Tiwari It’s skill, it’s completely skill, it’s skill and talent, it’s skill and talent.

Leo Laporte It’s a craft in that sense, it’s a craft in that sense, right?

Neha Tiwari Yes, because it has both of those.

John C. Dvorak It is.

Neha Tiwari It’s not that silly though.

John C. Dvorak It’s like being a painter.

Leo Laporte Now, I guess you are the wrong guy to ask here, Wil Harris, because you went to school to be a lawyer. Lot a good that did you.

Wil Harris I didn’t get...

Leo Laporte The barrister Wil Harris will now respond for the Crown’s Counsel.

Wil Harris I think a lot of this sort of – because I see an uptick in people wanting to do journalism, I think it’s because a lot of teenagers and school kids are getting a taste for publishing online and for having their stuff read and having their thoughts put out, and it makes them think about journalism in a way, blogging and the sort of social media revolution and as such has kind of made journalism a bit sexier possibly than it was before, bit more attractive to people to get involved with. However, I absolutely agree with John that taking a post grad journalism course is kind of mental at this point, you’d be far better off just going and getting a job, getting any kind of job, any kind of freelance, posting you own essays to your blog and then using that to get yourself a gig somewhere, it’s far more valuable, actual experience than to going and getting a grad course for sure.

John C. Dvorak And let’s, I am sorry, but let’s mention one more thing about journalism, colleges, schools, or whatever, like the Columbia School of Journalism, originally they were brought in to professionalize the trade, and it was done in a way, and in fact you, most people that really take a lot of journalists may get a degree, and it was designed to create cogs for cogs in the wheel, so you’d have like a neutral writing style, with no voice, you weren’t really a writer, you’re a journalist, you’re a reporter, you knew how to do, you wouldn’t, you could work at any newspaper, you would fit right into the scheme of things, you weren’t a columnist, you weren’t somebody trying to express themselves, you are just this cog in the wheel, you were trained just like a lawyer to be able to do a job anywhere, and that was the idea and so you end up with a whole bunch of people that are over trained in journalism, and this is a controversial thing I am saying, some people would deny it. But the fact is very few of them can do much more than report, they are good reporters but they are not authors, very few of them become novelists, a few of them can break away from it, but generally speaking, they write in a voiceless style that anybody can read and it is fairly neutral, and they are taught this, the principles of neutrality, even though it’s hard to maintain. And it doesn’t apply anymore, the whole world’s changed, this is not gonna fly, we think probably partisan writing is going to probably return to the fore which it was in like the 1800s where newspapers used to be like to press democrat, it used to be on one side of an issue, and they were papers that were independent, that kind of thing, everybody had a political perspective in these papers and that’s where it’s headed with blogging.

Leo Laporte It’s also where it’s headed with television, I mean, gosh you wouldn’t start a news channel unless you can figure out where you were, right, left or centre, these days.

John C. Dvorak Right.

Neha Tiwari I think it’s interesting too, because when I was talking to them to see like what they were looking for, it’s not, I mean my experience is mostly in the kind of the internet spectrum, all the writing that I have done has been in that kind of blogging creative style, and ultimately it seems like the board or whoever is deciding who gets admission into grad school, they’re looking for people who are like newspaper journalist or people who are much more traditional, which was fascinating to me, because that’s not the future, so…

John C. Dvorak What year was that?

Neha Tiwari Very – within the last three years.

John C. Dvorak Wow.

Neha Tiwari Yes, so that was eye opening for me.

Leo Laporte You are lucky you didn’t get in, to be honest with you.

Neha Tiwari I am thinking so.

Leo Laporte You would spend a lot of money in getting trained in a profession that’s dying.

Neha Tiwari Exactly, and I don’t think that I really need, perhaps I did not, I don’t really need that training, and I got it working at places.

Leo Laporte Yes, my daughter says she wants to learn the family business by going to Emerson and studying the broadcast program and I said, honey, this family’s business, I don’t know what business that is, what do you think your dad is Johnny Walker?

John C. Dvorak It might be fun to go to like, I mean if I was thinking about it, and I had to go to a big school, maybe like San Diego State which has a good broadcasting program, or UCLA, USC for maybe a movie career, but I would just say, just go to – from people that just are floating around and find a good junior college like College of San Mateo, and just go there for a year and just take broadcasting and few other things like that, I mean work in the studio because they are on the air, I mean that’s the closest, that station is as good as almost anything going on around the Bay Area.

Leo Laporte Yes.

John C. Dvorak Actually, surprisingly good.

Leo Laporte I really wonder, I mean we were in such a state of flux now, but I really wonder if – you have such an opportunity now to get your jobs in the actual environment, whether it’s doing a podcast or video streaming or on a blog writing, it almost seems like that’s the best way to learn, and isn’t that how journalists used to learn, it was a trade.

John C. Dvorak Yes, but they used to be taken under somebody’s wing.

Leo Laporte It was an apprenticeship, yes.

John C. Dvorak But right here, I mean let’s face it, your little operation over there is not coming from some guy who doesn’t know anything, who’s never been around the block, who’s never worked in the business, who doesn’t have a broadcasting background, it’s like extremely professional for a reason. Other people I have seen, I don’t see anybody else bringing up – their game up to the level that you have that are ranked amateurs and don’t have any help whatsoever from anybody.

Leo Laporte You’re right, there needs to be more mentoring going on, I have always mentored as much as I can, and invited people in and said here’s how we do it and given them feedback…

Neha Tiwari Yes.

Leo Laporte I think that that’s important. I remember when I got into broadcasting, I never went to broadcast school, I just did it and I was pretty awful for the first five years and I remember trying…

John C. Dvorak What school was this; five years?

Leo Laporte No, no I didn’t go to school. I mean there was the school of hard knocks – I mean, can I be honest. I was terrible for the first 10 years I was on the air. I was one of those guys – hey welcome to the show. We are going to have a great show for you coming up just a little bit, we are going to play a little music from Steele Dan, but right now it’s the Doobie Brothers, Jesus is Just Alright With Me.

Neha Tiwari You have the total announcer voice.

John C. Dvorak I like it. You should go back to that.

Leo Laporte Maybe that was my future, anyway I do remember when I was starting out that there was this ethos and that the people who are doing it right now would take you under their wing and teach you and bring you up and I think that – and they always said to me – I am going to take you under my wing, I am going to mentor you, I am going to show you what I know about broadcasting, but you are going to pass it along, you are going to pass it, pay it forward. I think that’s true.

Neha Tiwari But – and I think it’s very true. And I think, I mean feel very lucky to have had mentors, just mentors that I made actually at TechTV. I mean like…

Leo Laporte It wasn’t me, I was walking around in my underwear drunk by the time you got there.

Neha Tiwari No, I mean like for example, like Sarah…

Leo Laporte Sarah Lane.

Neha Tiwari Sarah Lane has been a mentor to me even…

Leo Laporte Great. Well, I mentored her, so it all works out.

Neha Tiwari Yeah, and even at Revision3, she mentored me as well and I still look up to her and I…

Leo Laporte There is that spirit, isn’t there.

Neha Tiwari There still is that spirit and there has been people who were interns when I worked at Revision3, I tried to pass on the torch and teach them whatever I know too.

Leo Laporte I wonder if the ShamWow guy is taking mentees on, because I am thinking that might be my future.

John C. Dvorak I think you’d be great.

Leo Laporte I’d love to do that. Hey camera guy, look at this! I would love to do that.

John C. Dvorak You’re kind of doing that anyway.

Leo Laporte [91:40] Yeah, I am a pitch guy. There is a certain amount of that has to happen. You know Monster Cable is at it again; they are suing a company called Monster Transmission. I don’t know why you would get confused…

John C. Dvorak Monster Transmission.

Leo Laporte …that when you go to Monster Transmission and performance in Florida, that you would think you are maybe buying high priced, over – some say over priced cables from Monster Cable. Remember they also sued Monster MiniGolf?

John C. Dvorak Here it is, I got the answer. The cables transmit data and electricity and so transmission is a word that they could employ in their sales pitch and so someone might be confused by Monster Transmission.

Leo Laporte I learned a little bit about this, we have a lawyer now, because there are a few companies that are doing streaming stuff with the word “twit” and while, Twitter is a different area, they have a trade – actually they don’t. You know what else I found out, they don’t have a trademark yet.

Neha Tiwari Oh, that’s interesting.

Leo Laporte But they, it has been pending for a couple of years. I don’t know what’s going on, anyway. So, we want to stop people from doing any streaming media or podcast or any audio entertainment or video entertainment under the name “twit” of any kind, even it’s about Twitter. So, I talked to the lawyer and he said the only way you can sue in this case is if people could be reasonably confused about what they are getting.

Neha Tiwari Yeah.

Leo Laporte So, if somebody does twit shoes, there is no confusion, it’s a different business, nobody is thinking they are getting TWiT the podcast or Twitter the microblog when they buy twit shoes. So, I don’t know how Monster even can justify this. It’s just out of…

Neha Tiwari It seems farfetched.

Leo Laporte It’s also bad PR. The whole geek community is down on these guys now.

Neha Tiwari It’s not the first time now.

John C. Dvorak Well, what real geek would use their stuff, it’s just expensive.

Leo Laporte That’s a good point.

Neha Tiwari It’s over priced.

Leo Laporte They apparently want to own the name Monster. So, you are not going to hear any Monster podcasts coming out of here, that’s for sure.

John C. Dvorak The Monster movie.

Neha Tiwari A Monster microblogging service.

Leo Laporte Monster microblogging. Yeah, I just go to They’ve never sued anybody.

Wil Harris The worst for this is Intel. Intel is absolutely dreadful at going around and trying to sue anybody that has the word Intel in any context in their domain name or their company. And of course “intel” is really commonly used as like an abbreviation for intelligence like for the intelligence community.

Neha Tiwari Right.

Wil Harris So, there is all kind of websites that are all about “next generation intel” or whatever dotcom and they get sued out of existence by Intel.

Leo Laporte Interesting, I didn’t know that.

Wil Harris Intel has some of the most hardcore trademark and copyright guys around – you can Google any number of websites that have got sort of kind of valid Intel complaints.

John C. Dvorak Well, on that note…

Leo Laporte No, no there is a couple of more notes. You want to go baste your lamb. Go ahead.

John C. Dvorak Yeah.

Leo Laporte There’s a couple of more notes. One is, I don’t think we talked about this last week, maybe we did. Actually, we did talk about Time Warner lowering these caps, introducing 50 gigabyte caps in some countries or some counties or cities, some regions in the United States, which is a ridiculously low number, but now it comes out that they perhaps are going to offer tier pricing. So, this is kind of a one-two punch. They first tell places like Austin, Texas we are going to limit you to 50 gigabytes a month and then they say, oh but, if you’re willing to pay $150 you can have unlimited download. We’ve kind of gone back and forth about this before, John, you and I – does that seem like a good solution to bandwidth caps, to just tier the pricing and…

John C. Dvorak Well, that’s your, that’s always been your argument.

Leo Laporte Yeah.

John C. Dvorak Yeah, you’ve always wanted to do that. So, you are now – what you’re trying to do is you’re trying to get me to drop my argument.

Leo Laporte No, I don’t want it to be that way, but I think that if you are going to, if you do, if you are going to offer caps, you’ve got to have some rational tiering going on. I mean 50 gigabyte cap is a ridiculous, John. You couldn’t watch, you couldn’t listen all my shows if you have a 50 gigabyte cap.

John C. Dvorak I don’t know, I have a meter on my system and it monitors my usage and I think and I am a pretty heavy user, I don’t listen to all your shows, I mean I should, but…

Leo Laporte Yes, you should.

John C. Dvorak But all your shows would use up, max –

Leo Laporte I don’t listen to all your shows either. You do as many as I.

John C. Dvorak Max 30 gigs a month, max. I can’t make myself get more than 30 gigs a month.

Leo Laporte Really, alright. Well, they’re going to – they’re apparently, they are planning, they say 30% of our customers use less than a gigabyte. They are going to offer a $15 a month high speed Internet, well relatively high speed, download speeds of 768 kilobits, upload at 128 kilobits for $15 a month, I think that’s great. But if you go over that gigabyte, it’s $2 a gigabyte additional. They also have a 10 gigabyte, 20 gigabyte, 40 gigabyte and 60 gigabyte caps and so you – and 100 – let’s say you want 100 gigabyte 75 bucks a month, 10 megabits per second, uploads at one megabit this to me kind of makes sense. I have to say this is the way to handle it. What is your argument, you think it should be unlimited?

John C. Dvorak Me?

Leo Laporte No, you don’t do you?

John C. Dvorak No, I thought it should be charged by the bit but that’s a reasonable solution.

Leo Laporte Instead of charging by the bit just say – here’s your max.

John C. Dvorak Yeah, there are people that don’t use it a lot, they just use e-mail; then why are they paying these high ridiculous prices? I think they should have fast access, everyone should have the same blazing speeds and if you are not going to use it that much you don’t – shouldn’t be paying for it, I mean, I feel sorry for people that you got one guy next door who is just hogging bandwidth and going crazy and downloading everything they can and then somebody else who just does e-mail, I mean, why are they paying the same amount? It doesn’t make sense.

Leo Laporte I think that’s right. Yeah, I am actually coming around to your way of thinking. Your position was well it costs the company’s money, I don’t think it cost them as much as they’d like you to think it costs them; it costs the companies money to offer better service, so charge for better service. I don’t think that’s such a bad thing.

Neha Tiwari Do you think that people are going to get caught up in the overages though?

Leo Laporte Yeah, I worry about that.

Neha Tiwari Yeah.

John C. Dvorak Well, yeah. I mean I would worry about that too.

Neha Tiwari That can end up expensive depending on…

John C. Dvorak I mean that’s what happens with cell-phone plans.

Neha Tiwari I just hate, I hate the whole concept of having an overage and an overage fee.

Leo Laporte I want unlimited, I would buy, I would buy whatever the unlimited was.

Neha Tiwari Yeah, I would, because I just don’t want to be limited by anything…

Leo Laporte Right.

Neha Tiwari …and with this you still even though it’s tier and perhaps it’s better for people who just check their e-mail, or very minimal usage but for those who have kind of normal use, its…

John C. Dvorak Well, it seems to me the way it should be done, if you are going to use tiered, is that if you have a low tier and you are subscribing and blah, blah, blah, and you all of a sudden jump to the overage mark, you should just be billed for the next tier.

Neha Tiwari Yeah, there should – it shouldn’t be like that incremental overage thing, which is what this is.

John C. Dvorak Which would and which I am describing is similar to my charge by the bit thing because essentially you got to pay more because you jumped over some sort of a plateau.

Leo Laporte So this is, I think this is sensible. So, the top-of-the-line service is $75 a month. For that you get 100 gigabytes as I mentioned at 10 megabits per second down and 1 up, but $1 extra per gigabyte capped at $75. So, now by the way they say this is just – we are trying this out. This is not, you know this may all change but they say so. So, if you pay – so that’s what I would probably get. I will get the $75-a-month service. That’s kind of top-of-the-line service knowing you could never go over a $150 even if I just used a ton of bandwidth.

Neha Tiwari Yeah.

John C. Dvorak Yeah, well, I recommend people go on the net and find some of these meters and you can meter your own usage.

Leo Laporte Where do you get that?

Neha Tiwari Yeah, where do you…

John C. Dvorak …And take a look at what you use. It’s on the other computer at the other house.

Leo Laporte I like that idea.

Neha Tiwari Yeah, that’s a great solution to that.

John C. Dvorak Yeah, it sits there and it meters but there are only meters on that machine. It doesn’t meter the whole network. I suppose there is someone that would.

Leo Laporte I would love a meter that would meter everything coming into this room.

John C. Dvorak Yeah, there will be probably something. I mean, if you look around there are meters – they are just, you know, they are essentially counting bits as it flies across the network.

Leo Laporte Right and we use it a ton of bandwidth here, a ton of bandwidth.

John C. Dvorak There’s probably some sniffer, that would be like...

Leo Laporte What’s your internet cost – you, Wil. Wil’s sinking, getting lower and lower on the screen. I think the Sancerre has gotten to you.

Wil Harris It’s all kicking in, you know what it’s like 20 quid a month, 20 quid a month I think for 10 down, 1 up.

Leo Laporte That’s pretty good and is there a bandwidth cap.

John C. Dvorak 35 bucks, not bad.

Wil Harris If there is, I have never encountered it. It’s one of those things where they call it unlimited but with like fair use and your fair use is never really quite defined, but I download quite a lot as you might expect and I have never really encountered it.

Leo Laporte Wil, you and I are kind of in the same business, we offer rich bandwidth content. ChannelFlip is, you know, if people downloaded everything you did that could add up. So, you must – you have a dog in this hunt, I mean you must care a little bit.

Wil Harris Well, what – I mean what we have over here that’s kind of interesting is that I mean I didn’t have a bandwidth cap that routinely packages assault on the amount that you can download. So most people if they buy the standard package from – the standard operator will have like a 10 gigabyte cap and that’s just like, they will pay 10 quid a month, they will get 10 gig and that’s it. You might pay 15 quid a month and get a 50 gig and that’s it. They might pay 20 quid and get unlimited cap. There is no differentiator in speed, only in the amount that you can download. We tend to not see any effect of that because the people who really want the extra bandwidth will just pay the extra 5 quid and get it.

Leo Laporte Wow. I was just seeing Guardian 653 in our chat room. He is using the tomato router which is firmware. We actually run the firmware on our Linksys WRT54G and it does monitor your monthly bandwidth use. He says he listens to most of the shows or rather watches most of the shows live on TWiT, 92 gigabytes a month. So, it’s possible.

John C. Dvorak Get out of the house for God sakes.

Neha Tiwari Get some sunshine.

Leo Laporte I look at the graphs of the data that we are sucking for people watching on – you know we have three channels now Ustream, Stickam and BitGravity and we are doing two or three terabytes a day now in video. So, if I had to pay for that, I would be in real trouble.

Wil Harris That’s a lot of videos.

Leo Laporte That’s a lot of video, a lot of video. All right, I’m going to – with 200 gigabytes at the warehouse Colleen says she watches, she meters you at the tomato, you use the tomato probably to meter the warehouse and that’s a bunch of users, how many different users where she was, three different users, 200 gigabytes a month. I don’t want to know what you guys, you do BitTorrent, you are using BitTorrent aren’t you. That’s without BitTorrent, wow. That’s excluding the BitTorrent traffic she says. They do it, not her. We want to make that perfectly clear.

Neha Tiwari Colleen doesn’t use torrents.

Leo Laporte Neha, it was so nice to see you, to meet you – although, I guess…

Neha Tiwari To re-meet.

Leo Laporte …I met you once when I was wandering around drugged and out of my head. The final day’s TechTV.

Neha Tiwari I don’t know what they were doing to you, I don’t know.

Leo Laporte Well, the electric shock was really painful after a while I have to say.

Neha Tiwari Yeah, it’s been great just being here, feels like home. So...

Leo Laporte Well, it is. Consider it your home. I hope we can do this new show with you. I would love to do. I am very excited about it.

Neha Tiwari It would be great. It would be really fun and I would like to come back sometime and it’s been really great interacting with everybody and the IRC chat, it’s been...

Leo Laporte Yeah, thank you for going in there, they get lonely.

Neha Tiwari …really good, really good meeting everybody and I hope you all keep in touch and stuff.

Leo Laporte

Neha Tiwari Yeah and I also this week I probably will be doing a segment on DL.TV. So...

Leo Laporte That’s cool. So, DL.TV is back up.

Neha Tiwari It’s back up. It’s going to be a new format that they are trying out.

Leo Laporte Will Robert Heron still be involved?

Neha Tiwari He’s still involved. It’s going to be a twice weekly offering and so I should hopefully be on the Thursday.

Leo Laporte Oh, I am so glad to hear that.

Neha Tiwari …Thursday edition. So, I am just doing some stuff there because I like it, I like the people that work at DL.TV very much and...

Leo Laporte Yeah, me too.

Neha Tiwari And obviously I am going to be, Colleen and I are going to try to work out and get V01d up and started, which should be super-rad.

Leo Laporte V01D.TV.

Neha Tiwari Yeah. So, that’s coming to internets near you.

Leo Laporte Maybe this internet.

Neha Tiwari Maybe this, maybe...

Leo Laporte Maybe even this one.

Neha Tiwari Right here, yeah.

Leo Laporte I told you I will be glad to foot the bill on that.

Neha Tiwari Yeah, it will be all about interactivity. I mean that’s something that I really dig on as we like to tell.

Leo Laporte The first one. They are going to a multi-touch – projector-based multi-touch display.

Neha Tiwari And really, I mean it’s for all levels of nerds. So don’t feel frightened or don’t feel like too this is so basic. It’s good for all and also I am on Twitter also, so @Nehalia. Okay, I am done plugging.

Leo Laporte @Nehalia. Wil Harris is @WilHarris. You will also find him at ChannelFlip.

Wil Harris Indeed you will at ChannelFlip. It’s going very well. We have been delighted to have, do you guys, in America, know a comedian called David Mitchell.

Leo Laporte No, nothing rings a bell.

Wil Harris Okay, very famous in the UK for being on the BBC and he’s sort of the U.K. version of John Hodgman, really. In fact he was the PC in the U.K. version of the Mac and PC ads. Anyway he’s been doing a weekly series for us on ChannelFlip and it’s been the most popular thing on iTunes for the past two months.

Leo Laporte Congratulations.

Wil Harris Which is delightful to be beating out the BBC and all such other comers to be on top of the iTunes chart, so that’s very pleasing. We also have a podcast along with Rob Llewellyn.

Leo Laporte He’s doing Carpool, right. Is that part of your...?

Wil Harris So, he’s doing, so he does Carpool but also does a weekly one for us called Machine of the Week, which is a weekly look at the coolest kind of electric vehicles and latest Car Tech which is very good fun.

Leo Laporte So cool.

Wil Harris So you can watch both those, either you can get them through iTunes on the ChannelFlip section on iTunes or you can just go to and watch them.

Leo Laporte Please give my best to Bobby Llewellyn because I am so glad Red Dwarf came, the new Red Dwarf…

Wil Harris Will do.

Leo Laporte I hear great things about it, that’s neat. That’s really exciting. Thank you Wil Harris, John C. Dvorak is at, I think, in no small way influenced by

John C. Dvorak Well, actually did that out of the blue but maybe I know – yeah, absolutely because I am a big fan of ChannelFlip.

Wil Harris Oh, you are a sweetheart, check’s in the mail.

John C. Dvorak Channeldvorak – I needed some more numbers on my thing....

Leo Laporte @THErealDVORAK on Twitter.

John C. Dvorak @THErealDVORAK.

Leo Laporte And we thank the folks on FriendFeed because we are now doing kind of a FriendFeed room in our TWiT conversations room for every show and that’s a great way to interact, but also after the fact to go back, see what people were saying and add your own comments to the show. is the place to see that.

We remind you that we are on iTunes like everybody else, just search for TWiT in the iTunes store. We have a lot of different shows including this one. If you subscribe, you get it every week. TWiT Pics is online too at Colleen picks great stuff that we mention on the shows and gives you chance to pick it up and support TWiT at the same time, not in all cases. Sometimes we don’t make any money often, but if it’s on Amazon we get the Amazon associate fee and I am not going to tell you my Twitter handle because I don’t care. Thanks for joining us and I will see you next week.

Neha Tiwari Leo’s beyond that.

Leo Laporte I am beyond, I am over that. I am so over Twitter. Another TWiT is in the can.