TWiT 274/Transcript

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Episode 274


This transcript is provided by our friends at Pods in Print

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This is TWiT, this WEEK in TECH, Episode 274, recorded November 14, 2010, I'll Take The Frisking.

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It’s time for TWiT, this WEEK in TECH. We’re going to cover the latest tech news all around the world. Joining me now in studio, I’m very happy to see the man with the hair, Mr. Brian Brushwood.

Brian Brushwood Hey, that’s me because Owen doesn’t have hair.

Leo Laporte Yeah, so it have to be you, wouldn’t it?

Brian Brushwood Yeah, that’s right, deduction, sir.

Leo Laporte Brian is back from his triumphant engagement in Orlando at the –

Brian Brushwood Halloween Horror Nights.

Leo Laporte Halloween Horror Nights.

Brian Brushwood Universal Orlando puts on like the number one tourist destination if you are into Halloween and getting scared, they have like 8 haunted houses, 3 stage shows, bunch of scare-zones, it was 6 weeks of 4 to 5 nights a week, 4 to 6 shows per night.

Leo Laporte What?

Brian Brushwood It’s insane, yeah.

Leo Laporte What?

Brian Brushwood And they got these giant 1,000 plus seat auditorium, they pack it every single show.

Leo Laporte Holy cow!

Brian Brushwood It just is non-stop.

Owen JJ Stone Brian’s packing it every single show two times a night.

Leo Laporte That’s amazing.

Owen JJ Stone Four times a night.

Brian Brushwood No, 4 to 6, four on regular nights, six on peak nights.

Leo Laporte That voice is the well-dressed Owen JJ Stone, OhDoctah from and AskOhDoctah, the fine podcast. He’s today would be imbibing the fine Guyana Royal Extra Mature Demerara Rum.

Brian Brushwood Amazing stuff.

Owen JJ Stone Once you open it, you have to finish it.

Leo Laporte That’s what I have been told.

Brian Brushwood So it’s going to be one of those shows is what you’re saying.

Leo Laporte It’s going to be one of those. It’s going to be one of those.

Owen JJ Stone It’s definitely going to be one of those shows.

Leo Laporte Also with us from the great Xeni Jardin. It’s so good to see you, Xeni.

Xeni Jardin Hi, Leo.

Leo Laporte Thanks for joining us. She is not drinking – oh, my god! Oh, my god!

Xeni Jardin What? I got my nails done especially for the show, you like them? See.

Leo Laporte She’s got some bizarre fruit. What is that?

Xeni Jardin I think it’s called the Hand of Buddha, Mano de Buda, but maybe some of the TWiT audience can tell me exactly what it is. I like to call it finger fruit.

Brian Brushwood Yes.

Leo Laporte She’s got the nose.

Brian Brushwood Have you tasted it? It looks citrusy. Is it citrusy?

Xeni Jardin It’s – if I can put on a wine-snob adjective flow for a moment here, it’s like a really fine fresh lemon with hints of jasmine and undertones of fruitcake.

Leo Laporte And undertones of death. I want it.

Brian Brushwood I love Cthulhu.

Leo Laporte Well Cthulhu entices you into your death. Yes.

Brian Brushwood That’s right.

Leo Laporte Umm, the claw of Cthulhu.

Xeni Jardin On my keyboard it lies dreaming.

Leo Laporte Okay, leave it there because it scares the hell out of me.

Xeni Jardin Okay.

Leo Laporte Also here, speaking of scaring the hell out of me,

John C. Dvorak And in reference to the jersey you are wearing, I should mention today’s score, Miami, 29; Tennessee, 17; good work.

Leo Laporte I am wearing a Tennessee Titans jersey, thanks to OhDoctah.

Owen JJ Stone Yes, TWiT colors.

Leo Laporte Who is this --

Owen JJ Stone Chris Johnson.

Leo Laporte Chris Johnson. How is Johnson is doing, John? Is he --

John C. Dvorak I think he’s quit the team.


Leo Laporte So embarrassed, so embarrassed.

Owen JJ Stone It’s a throwback. It’s an instant class, Uncle Leo. It just went up in value. That’s how you answer that question.

Leo Laporte Thank you for letting me wear this. This is very nice.

Owen JJ Stone John, calm down. We’re drunk.

Leo Laporte So tomorrow 10 A.M. and we are going to cover it live, Facebook has yet another, I can’t believe Facebook, it seems like almost every week now they’re having a town hall and announcing something. No one knows for sure but the rumors are, and I think pretty good rumors, Facebook’s going to do a Gmail killer, a Facebook email. They have got the domain,, which they apparently snookered out of the Farm Bureau.

Brian Brushwood Really? No lies?

Xeni Jardin I was kind of hoping they would call it

Leo Laporte Fmail.

Xeni Jardin Fmail.

Leo Laporte No, they got FB.

Xeni Jardin I’ll send you a Fmail.

Leo Laporte Fmail, it’s a new kind of email, it’s F-mail.

Brian Brushwood So I know you left Facebook and then had to come crawling back on your hands and knees.

Leo Laporte And I have and now I can see why because Face – it’s where it’s happening.

Brian Brushwood So I was going to say, are you happy now that you are back? Do you think it’s doing stuff right? Or was it a symbolic gesture over privacy? Or are you really digging it now that you are back into it?

Leo Laporte No, I don’t dig Facebook. There’s this element of social compulsion it feels like to me that if you participate then – your friends are there and I have only added friends this time, not strangers and you just feel like you have to kind of represent --

Owen JJ Stone It’s a tool to use.

Leo Laporte I don’t feel like it’s a tool.

Brian Brushwood And I wonder --

Leo Laporte I feel like I am pressured.

Brian Brushwood I am like – I wonder if I am insulated because I never made it about my – like my real friends. It was like – the answer is yes to everyone. It’s another broadcast platform.

Leo Laporte You are Mr. Showbiz. That’s how you used it at first. And this time I decided to use it – the only reason I came back is because I wanted to – when Places came out, I said, oh, well now I have to try that. And I am glad I did because they have been adding a lot of things and you cannot cover tech without covering these days without covering Facebook. You have to.

Owen JJ Stone It’s part of your job.

Leo Laporte And it’s – I never worry about privacy personally.

John C. Dvorak Oh, this is baloney.


Leo Laporte John?

John C. Dvorak I mean seriously, give me one reason that you have to cover Facebook if you cover tech. Oh, Intel came out with a new chip. Let’s see what Facebook has to say about it.

Leo Laporte First of all, John, it shows how out-of-date you are. We don’t care about Intel’s new chips. That’s not where the news is. The news is in mobile. The news is in search. The news is in social. That’s the news in tech these days.

And I remember for years – the last year people have bitched at us for talking about Twitter so much, including you, John. But that’s --

John C. Dvorak Yes, because you were talking about Twitter too much.

Leo Laporte That was the story. And I think Facebook is a big story. So if Facebook does Gmail, do they do a wide-open mail system or do they do an extension of Facebook messaging. I’ll tell you why they might want to do the latter because there is no spam. So far.

Brian Brushwood No. Okay, the proposal as I am hearing it from you is that this is an email system that only happens – you can – it’s a closed email system like nobody from the outside can --

Leo Laporte We don’t know. We’ll find out tomorrow. But they have a choice, they could make it an open email system.

Brian Brushwood Right.

Owen JJ Stone Which is a smart thing to do.

Brian Brushwood Well, I mean that’s – I mean how would you have an email system that be is closed.

Leo Laporte Well, I think what you do – well, then – you already do, it’s the Facebook messaging.

Brian Brushwood Right. Right.

Leo Laporte Although I guess anybody can message you. Because I get messages from strangers.

Owen JJ Stone Well, yeah, they can. Because when they want to add you, they can send a message before they add you to get to you.

Leo Laporte Okay. But they can’t kind of message you a lot, only for an add request.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah, I think that’s how that works.

Leo Laporte I think a two-tiered system. One is, these are validated people on Facebook, we know – because Facebook says, we know who you are. These are valid, real people. And then, these are not Facebook people if they’re in a separate inbox.

Owen JJ Stone It has to be open. I mean who – number one, people don’t switch email that much. And to switch from Gmail, like with my docs and all the other things that come with Google…

Leo Laporte Well, it’s going to be hard, isn’t it?

Xeni Jardin I mean really? Like, you’re going to give me email? Whoop-de-do. I mean they’re going to get young kids to start up on it and get numbers. But people aren’t – don’t just switch email like that. Especially just for what, an email? Really?

Leo Laporte Xeni, what are you hearing? Do you think Facebook’s going to do an email system tomorrow?

Xeni Jardin I think I’m hearing the noise from all the same places that you are. But the one thing I have to ask is, why on earth would anybody trust Facebook…

Leo Laporte [Laughter] Yes.

Owen JJ Stone Thank you.

Xeni Jardin With their record of privacy, with email? I mean…

Leo Laporte Do you trust Google?

Xeni Jardin No, I don’t use Gmail. Well, I’ll correct that. I do use Gmail for bulk accounts only and for – occasionally if somebody needs to send something like a Google Document. But I don’t trust Gmail with anything that I wouldn’t want published or sent to the Feds.

Leo Laporte Who do you trust with your…

John C. Dvorak Exactly. Exactly.

Leo Laporte Who do you use? Do you Hushmail, who do you use?

Xeni Jardin If I told you, I’d have to…

Leo Laporte Well, you don’t use – okay, because you’re not going to use your internet service provider, because that’s going to be even worse than Google. You don’t…

Xeni Jardin No, I do use my internet service provider.

Leo Laporte But you have a high-security one?

Xeni Jardin I have an ISP that I trust more than I trust Facebook or more than I trust a free service. I pay my ISP…

Owen JJ Stone Good answer.

Xeni Jardin The domains are hosted in Canada.

Leo Laporte Oh, well that’s why you’re safe.

Xeni Jardin For a lot of what we do at BoingBoing. So there’s different things that you can do to improve your email security, and using free web-based services – I don’t even know enough about Hushmail to really feel fully trustful there.

Leo Laporte Right. Hushmail incorporates PGP encryption, but you’re right, we don’t know what happens at either end.

Brian Brushwood I used Hushmail for a while before it felt like a hassle to go through – and I’d get lazy. I hate that I’m one of the cattle that’s just – oh, I don’t know, I really should be more private, but this is just so easy. Thank you, Gmail.

Leo Laporte Xeni, do you use Canadian hosts because Corey’s from Toronto?

Xeni Jardin I think that’s actually how it started, but over the years it’s served us very well when we’ve been on the receiving end of SLAPP lawsuits, different kinds of lawsuits or legal threats intended to limit what we publish and limit critical speech. So it served us well but it actually didn’t start out as a way to certainly evade any law. I’ll say also as far as web security, a big fan of what the people behind the Tor Project do. I use Tor every day, no matter whether I’m in this questionably democratic regime or another one. I travel to Guatemala, Africa, Asia a lot. And I like to take extra precautions wherever I go.

Leo Laporte You’re really paranoid.

Xeni Jardin Well, you know I think five or 10 years ago, I – you would have expected me to come on the podcast wearing a tinfoil beanie cap with talk like that. But I think these days, it’s prudent. It’s like, yeah, I have locks on the door in my house, too.

Leo Laporte And it’s government you fear most?

Xeni Jardin Well, no. I mean it’s government, it’s spammers, it’s – there are any number of threats.

Brian Brushwood You’re just saying like on principle, it’s just good practice to just do it. Because it doesn’t matter – you don’t know what it’s going to…

Xeni Jardin It’s good hygiene. I may not know every possible threat, but I do know a number of pretty stupid, easy things that you can do to reduce the likelihood that those threats will cause bad things to happen.

Leo Laporte Well, the other way to do it is how I do Facebook and how I do email, which is just assume it’s public and not put anything that I wouldn’t want to be public on those services.

Xeni Jardin But even with that, I think there are risks involved. I mean whoever you connect to, you just said that you primarily connect to people tat you know in real life. And even though you’re not specifically saying here’s the information about my bank account, or here’s some information about my wife or my kids – the fact that you’ve connected to people, that you have some kind of real world connection with, something could theoretically be gleaned from that that you might not want.

Leo Laporte Well, and that’s one problem with Facebook, is that it doesn’t seem to be constrained just to the people that you connect with. Any application they run then has access to you as well as them. I mean obviously Facebook is a sieve.

John C Dvorak And let’s not forget one thing.

Leo Laporte What’s that?

John C Dvorak It all comes out in discovery.


Leo Laporte I don’t know what that means.

Xeni Jardin Subpoena.

John C Dvorak Anytime there’s a lawsuit, they go through this thing called discovery. And they just grab everything they can and they go through all of it and they say, well this is what’s important. And by the way, look at this weird stuff Leo did, let’s throw that out. Throw it out into the public domain.

Owen JJ Stone It’s the thing of how people that put at the bottom of their email, ‘confidential agreement,’ at the bottom of their email, I’m like – why did you just waste three paragraphs at the bottom of the email? Again, assume everything’s public. Don’t spam me with your legal notice of ‘do not share, this is between you and me.’ Like, no, it’s between you, me, Google and whoever else you’ve cc’ed on this email.

Leo Laporte But now I’m getting a little depressed.


John C Dvorak Well, you should.

Owen JJ Stone That’s the liquor talking…

Leo Laporte That’s the liquor talking.

Owen JJ Stone I’m so depressed.

John C Dvorak Have some more – have another drink, it’ll make you feel a lot better.

Owen JJ Stone You know it always cheers me up (12:39).

Leo Laporte No, I’m a little depressed, because now I can’t – it sounds like I can’t reasonably use any of these things like Facebook, Gmail, Twitter, all the stuff that I like.

Owen JJ Stone Are you doing that much illegal stuff that you need to worry about it?

Leo Laporte Now that’s the Eric Schmidt argument, yeah, ‘if you don’t do anything wrong, what do you have to fear.’ But obviously…

John C Dvorak That’s bogus and he should never say that, because he’s so paranoid. But let me bring up something about that little dot, that little statement at the bottom of some emails. The reason that that’s there – yeah, it looks kind of stupid. But if there’s again another legal situation that occurs, you can be kind of taken off the…

Leo Laporte Does it insulate you? Does it somehow protect you?

John C Dvorak No, no. What it does is, if you actually violate that little statement, in other words you got the wrong email and then you bring it out to somebody, they just throw you on the stand and say, well this is actually illegal, and you apparently are a lawbreaker by doing this, so you are now impugned. I mean everything that we do in this country has got some legal angle…

Leo Laporte Wait a minute, I got my lawyer right here. Is that going to protect me if I put the thing at the bottom of the email?

John C Dvorak It’s not going to protect you, it’s going to impugn somebody else.

Leo Laporte He says it doesn’t do doodly-squat. I think is the term of art that they use in law.

Brian Brushwood It sounds like John is not saying that it actually does something. What it does is it gives you leverage on the witness stand to take somebody down and say…

John C. Dvorak Exactly.

Brian Brushwood It’s more – it gives you a tactical edge if something actually goes to trial and you have someone on the stand you’re able to say.

Leo Laporte I feel – I feel so – and I feel, I only imagine how normal people feel…

John C. Dvorak Liquor’s working on these guys.


Brian Brushwood It’s like, it’s like we’re at his first drinking party. It’s like we’re at a frat party and he just discovered the keg. He’s like, guys, you don’t understand, I just feel so much [indiscernible] (14:26)…

Owen JJ Stone To a AA meeting.

John C. Dvorak ‘Love you guys, I love you guys.’

Owen JJ Stone ‘Facebook, man, it’s just so bad.’

Leo Laporte I feel so helpless in the face of all this, because it sounds like the really the only prudent thing to do would be not use the Internet at all.

Brian Brushwood And I will tell you I was going to say that you are a little bit better equipped to deal with this than most people and that you are accustomed to living your life in the public eye, so you…

Leo Laporte I gave up a long time ago.

Brian Brushwood Exactly, and you…

Leo Laporte Unfortunately my wife and kids have kind of got to suffer that brunt and my four mistresses and my 8 families, and the family in Canada and all of them…


Brian Brushwood But the, but the important thing is that even with the fact that you are accustomed to riding your life in Sharpie, where you don’t get to take anything backsies, and instead all you get to do is write around it and try to do your best to say what you really want to say – it – I mean I’m like a million steps behind you but I wanted the same thing and I just wanted to have any insight.

Leo Laporte What are you saying that you guys – lookit. We have got Brian Brushwood, OhDoctah, and Xeni Jardin. We have got John C. Dvorak. We have got kind of the crème de la crème of the technical world saying in effect to me, oh the Internet, a bad idea.


John C. Dvorak It is.

Owen JJ Stone No one is saying that!

John C. Dvorak I think so.

Owen JJ Stone No one is saying that.

John C. Dvorak It’s always been a bad idea.

Brian Brushwood It doesn’t matter, at the end of the day you are still going to send emails. You are still going to do a show, you’re building an empire, you’re not getting off the Internet, it doesn’t matter.

John C. Dvorak The kind of money he is making he is not stupid to do a show.

Leo Laporte Let me ask Xeni, let me ask Xeni am I am stupid to use the Internet?

Xeni Jardin Am I the only sober person here?

Leo Laporte Am I stupid to use the Internet?

Xeni Jardin You are not stupid to use the Internet.

Leo Laporte Then what do we do, I mean, you just described the situation that is pretty untenable.

Xeni Jardin So, it’s like, are you stupid to have a house? Are you stupid to have a car? No. But you take…

John C. Dvorak Yes!

Xeni Jardin … precautions – okay. You take precautions in the way that you live your live with regard to…

Leo Laporte I don’t lock my doors, by the way.

Brian Brushwood I actually have…

John C. Dvorak Oh no…

Xeni Jardin TMI, buddy.

Owen JJ Stone I’m following uncle Leo home.

John C. Dvorak He’s got lots of gear. He’s got a camera.

Brian Brushwood I think I get the point that we are all having, it’s that that when you live your live on the Internet, you live your live out in the public for everyone to see and the only time it really matters is when it keeps you from achieving something later on, when you try to run for President…

Leo Laporte Well I am not running for President, I am not looking for work, I guess I am screwed, but no I am not, no. I wish Jeff Jarvis was here because Jeff is a great advocate for living in public. He is writing a book called Public Parts right now. His point is, if we all just live in, look at we all have the same freaking skeletons in our closet, we are no different.

John C. Dvorak No we don’t, we don’t have the same ones.

Brian Brushwood No, no, no, this is, I have…

Leo Laporte We have different ones but they are roughly the same in general shape.

John C. Dvorak Not necessarily.

Brian Brushwood This steps almost exactly to where I was hoping it would. Because the next story that I wanted to talk about is that police recruits are now being screened for what they have said and done on social networks…

Leo Laporte I know.

Brian Brushwood …and Facebook And those skeletons come out.

Leo Laporte But this is the deal they make. You apply for the job in law enforcement and the law enforcement people have to ask you, okay, if you want this job – they don’t do without your permission – we are going – we need your passwords, we need to scan…

Brian Brushwood All you aliases, any names you’ve ever played.

Leo Laporte And you don’t have to play the game, you just say well I am I am not going to apply for that job, but you can’t get the job without exposing yourself.

Brian Brushwood But the idea of…

Leo Laporte But that’s fair, you’re law enforcement, there’s a higher standard.

John C. Dvorak You have to expose yourself and the information or just one?

Leo Laporte Everything.

Owen JJ Stone Give your password?

Leo Laporte But if you are applying a job…

Owen JJ Stone You could just change your password later, that’s not a big deal.

Brian Brushwood Oh, my goodness, that’s crazy though.

Owen JJ Stone You change your password before you even go to them and make it Mickey Mouse and say here’s my password Mickey Mouse, you go check it, then you change it.

Leo Laporte You guys, you are ignoring my question. Okay, it sounds like you are describing a Wild West Internet where privacy is futile, is a crazy goal.

Owen JJ Stone Can I say something?

Leo Laporte Is that the case? Yes OhDoctah.

Owen JJ Stone Privacy does not matter. That’s not why everybody is upset…

Leo Laporte That’s what Jarvis says, Jarvis says you might as well live in public, we all live in public.

Owen JJ Stone It’s not about privacy, it’s about control. The thing about Facebook is when things are hidden and you don’t know how to turn things on or off is about not having control over your content, you know what, if you don’t want to get to caught with dirty underwear put clean underwear and don’t get hit by a car.

Leo Laporte That’s the Eric Schmidt model, which is don’t do anything bad.

Owen JJ Stone So you just don’t do – do what you want to do, but know that it might come out. I mean if you are a bad person, you are bad person; if you are a good person, you are a good person, it’s not about privacy.

John C. Dvorak Oh, brother.

Leo Laporte My attitude is, here is my feeling, my feeling is we all are the same, we have all the same flaws. Yeah, I smoked pot, yeah, I used acid, yeah occasionally I like [bleep] a donkey, but it doesn’t…


John C. Dvorak All right, we got that one on tape, ladies and gentlemen.

Leo Laporte Okay, okay. It’s, we are all the same.

Owen JJ Stone We are all the same. Brian did that last weekend.

John C. Dvorak A lot of people didn’t smoke pot, lot of people didn’t take – drop acid.

Leo Laporte No, what I’m saying...

John C. Dvorak And then once you say you smoke pot in public and make it a public thing, you’re going to – and especially, like, say for example you have a pilot’s license…

Leo Laporte Look at the difference...

John C. Dvorak Your insurance is either going to be pulled or it is going to be raised through the roof.

Leo Laporte Look at the difference between Bill Clinton who said, ‘oh I didn’t inhale.’ And Barack Obama said ‘hell yeah, I inhaled.’

Brian Brushwood And you stole my idea, I was trying to set this up from the very beginning. I was going to say like right now the news is OMG they are looking in our Facebooks right? And what is going to become is that we are going to become bored with the secrets that we discover and then we are going to know that everybody – we have an entire generation of working adults starting right now, the 18 to 24 year olds who have been living their life, their young adult life in public, who have all number of stories written about them, photos taken at parties, compromising stories, language that they said…

Leo Laporte They are all going to have – in the same boat, right?

Brian Brushwood And it’s going to – just as it used to be 20 years ago, the idea of a president who smoked marijuana was insane, just crazy talk. And so you had to come up with some kind of hedge, like ‘well, I smoked but I didn’t inhale.’ But then now it’s like, we’re bored of that, we are like yes, yes, of course…

Leo Laporte Of course you did.

John C. Dvorak You know, can I – please stop for a second at least throw something in?

Brian Brushwood Yes.

John C. Dvorak This is – you guys are talking from a technical group, California perspective. There’s plenty of people in Arkansas, Kansas, North Dakota that don’t put all their pictures online and…

Leo Laporte Well, they will. That’s just because they’re behind, yeah, they will.

Owen JJ Stone As soon as they can afford it, yeah.

John C. Dvorak Not necessarily – take, take a look around and say, what? This is crazy to do this. I do due diligence on people all the time and some of you are going to do a meeting, and I’ll go and look him up on Flickr and I’ll say, oh, my God, this person is a douchebag. You can just tell by their photos.


Leo Laporte Well, that’s you, John. John used to review software by looking at the box.


John C. Dvorak You guys laugh but it’s true.


Leo Laporte Now, we’re going to take a break. I don’t know where this…

John C. Dvorak We’ll get back and we’ll explain how you do – how you review software by looking at the box.

Brian Brushwood I think they tie it in a bow. I’m of Leo’s camp, that you live your life on the record, you’ve always lived your life on the record. The record have changed a little bit and I think we’re going to see the world, more warts and all, for –

Leo Laporte And that’s a good thing in the long run.

Brian Brushwood I think so too.

John C. Dvorak No, it’s a bad thing.

Brian Brushwood No, it will keep us from these unrealistic body expectations.

Leo Laporte You think – yeah, exactly.

Brian Brushwood On this unrealistic moral standards. Okay, there it goes.

Leo Laporte When Ohdoctah did –

John C. Dvorak I already have the picture of that, Leo. It’s on the Internet.


Leo Laporte Exactly! What – nothing like – when you, JJ, I was so impressed. You did the parity of the Old Spice guy and you’re topless and you know you are not exactly Paris Hilton.

Owen JJ Stone I’ve lost 14 pounds, Uncle Leo. I can do it again right now, look a little bit better than the last time.

John C. Dvorak Have another drink.

Leo Laporte But you know what? I loved that and everybody loved it that you did it because you are you. And everybody says, yeah, I got man-boobs, no big deal. And it’s not – I don’t do that, but…

Brian Brushwood All right.

Leo Laporte But my, my – very serious point is and I’m with you, Brian on this. Is that, that’s – I think that’s going to be progress when people just go, this is how we are.

Brian Brushwood And it’s not --

John C. Dvorak This is bullcrap. This is a passive attitude toward privacy which is going to ruin this country. That’s why people are walking through that x-ray device. They don’t give a crap that they’re getting essentially a chest x-ray. I got a bit opt out. They get patted down, their nuts get grabbed. Nobody complains about it.

Owen JJ Stone I got my nuts grabbed and I was not excited about it. Look, look, no --

Brian Brushwood No, all right. Let me say two things. First of all, first of all, I’m with you on the x-ray thing. If I had to choose between the peep show and getting felt up, I always chose being felt up. It’s awkward and they are ashamed to do it and that’s the way an invasion of privacy should be.

Leo Laporte You want to make them feel bad.

Brian Brushwood That’s right. That’s right. That’s why you are grabbing my junk and it’s awkward for both of us and that’s how it should be. But – let me say what I’m trying to say about the warts and all and understanding who people are. This is a manifestation of the high definition culture that we’re joining into. And it’s just our privacy on Facebook. It’s the fact that we watch Hi-Def TV and you can see the zits on people. You can see the makeup that Jay Leno’s wearing on The Tonight Show.

Leo Laporte Because the truth is –

Brian Brushwood We see things the way they actually are.

Leo Laporte In the first 100 years of media, it polished people. It made – it lied about people. And I think that we all agree that the magazines and the television and movies created a false standard that was unattainable and has caused great pain for normal people for the last 100 years. Media has misused its ability. This is an opportunity for media to say – and this is kind of what we do here. Boy, this is warts and all media, if you ever – if you ever…

John C. Dvorak This is like a false argument. You’re equating somebody to having a lot of makeup on a TV show with a 250 line scan with the invasion of personal privacy. I don’t understand that.

Brian Brushwood Oh, no, no. I’m not, I’m not because I am fundamentally opposed to the x-ray machines and in fact, I don’t know – they have recently – or is it coming up? Wednesday, November 24, 2010 is National Opt-Out Day. Now most people don’t know on the x-ray machines, you can always opt out. All you have to say is, I opt out and then they give you a pat-down search.

Leo Laporte And then if we all did it…

Brian Brushwood I do that.

Leo Laporte Air traffic would stop.

Owen JJ Stone When I just flew here this weekend, I wore the same sweatpants I wore last week to go to LA. This weekend when I came in, it’s like, oh, they just changed the rules this week. Do you want a private screening or do you want me to pat you down here? I’m like, what you mean? He’s like, ‘well, do you want us to take you to the backroom or do you want to do it out here?’ What does it entail? ‘I have to go in your waistband, put my hand down your pants, I’m going to doing it out here.’ And I stood in front of everybody and he did it.

Leo Laporte Wait a minute. What’s the alternative? Can I go through a machine?

John C. Dvorak No.

Owen JJ Stone No, the alternative is for him to go in the backroom and pat – I had –

Leo Laporte He’s going to put his hands down your pants no matter what?

Owen JJ Stone He did, yes. And I said I’d rather have it do it out here in public, because that’s what Brian said. He’s already ashamed to do it, and I feel like he’s not going to go as deep –

Leo Laporte When did this happen?

Owen JJ Stone This weekend!

Leo Laporte They require to put their hands down your pants?

Owen JJ Stone They just changed the rules. He put his hands on –

Leo Laporte Wait a minute. You’re blowing my mind here.

Owen JJ Stone This is the line…

Leo Laporte This is the new TSA is that you have to get –

Owen JJ Stone If you are wearing sweat pants or baggy clothing –

Leo Laporte Oh, baggy clothing.

Owen JJ Stone I was wearing sweat pants. They’re not baggy. They are sweat pants. He put his hand – this is my waistband –

Leo Laporte Because I’m going to tell you, if I have to get somebody’s hands on my pants, I’m not flying.

Owen JJ Stone And ran his hand around the ring of my waistband and then patted the front and then patted my butt and then my crotch.

Leo Laporte And you know it’s security theater, it does absolutely nothing.

Brian Brushwood That’s the part that kills me. Is that – is that for all of the federalization, for all of this giant bureaucracy, for the $5 that you have to pay for every single flight going and coming back everywhere you go, we get not 1 percentage point bump.

Leo Laporte In security?

Brian Brushwood Yeah.

Owen JJ Stone And he was embarrassed to do it. And he says sorry like five times. It’s like I’m sorry, I’m sorry, I’m sorry.

Leo Laporte Excuse me, but would you like that job?

Owen JJ Stone No.

Leo Laporte Horrible job.

Brian Brushwood And I ran it – or you know what’s funny is, anyone who follows my Twitter feeds.

Leo Laporte Xeni, just – I apologize. I just want to apologize.

Xeni Jardin You know I didn’t realize that this broadcast was going to be about warts, man boobs….

Leo Laporte I’m sorry. I’m so sorry. I just don’t know what to say. Later, we will talk about poking the Queen. But first –

Xeni Jardin Or like cupcakes or something, I don’t know.

Leo Laporte Cupcakes, marcha tea, anything. Thank God, you are here to – just to lend us – just a slightest touch of class.

Xeni Jardin Can I just say one word, though?

Leo Laporte Please.

Xeni Jardin Israel. Have any of you guys are flown into or out of Israel?

Brian Brushwood No, have you experienced that? Because I hear legends about it.

John C. Dvorak I have. I’ve flown in and out of Israel.

Leo Laporte Is it more secure – and it’s more secure, right?

Xeni Jardin So, what do you think about their airport security versus ours?

John C. Dvorak Well, actually Brazil has a very similar structure although Israel does a little more. They just have a series of people – probably less than a number of total TSA people we have at SFO – and they all have their little stations and you go up and they grill you.

Leo Laporte They grill you. It’s by the way, that’s more effective than a search, is looking you in the eyes, say, what brings you here?

John C. Dvorak Yeah, why you’re leaving?

Xeni Jardin Exactly.

John C. Dvorak What did you do while you were here?

Leo Laporte Do you know what’s wrong with that? It takes a lot of training. And we aren’t spending the money to train people. You don’t take any trainee to put somebody’s hands down the – Ohdoctah’s sweat pants.

Owen JJ Stone Trust me.

John C. Dvorak Oh, that’s strange.

Xeni Jardin That takes no intelligence at all.

John C. Dvorak Easy for you to say.

Leo Laporte But Israel and I guess Brazil are willing to spend the time to train a true security force to interrogate people. Essentially that’s what they are doing, right, John?

John C. Dvorak Yeah, and they know what to look for and they have – you know they look for body language, people sweating profusely as they’re going through the line.

Leo Laporte That works much better.

John C. Dvorak Your attitude. And you know they can also do some profiling, which isn’t necessarily a bad thing. And like that guy who had an underwear bomber guy. He had – he looked like a nervous wreck, that character.

Leo Laporte I mean he was sweating, he was nervous, he was shaking, yeah.

Xeni Jardin Yeah.

Brian Brushwood What? And none of that’s going to be show up in this x-ray thing. This x-ray thing is ridiculous.

John C. Dvorak No, it’s just bogus. It just that – don’t forget that Chertoff, the ex-Homeland Security bonehead, is the head of the consulting company that has set these things up to be dropped in every airport in the country. The whole thing is corrupt – is to sell more of these stupid machines so these guys can make a killing. These machines are overpriced, they’re probably not even safe, nobody knows. UCSF has done a whole report on this questioning the technology from top to bottom. It’s a disaster and it’s corrupt and you got Chertoff involved. Give me a break! And nobody’s saying anything?

Owen JJ Stone I love when he gets fired up.

Leo Laporte I know.

Owen JJ Stone Get him, John, get him.

Xeni Jardin John, I have never agreed with you more than agree with you today.

John C. Dvorak Nine days.

Leo Laporte It’s actually scandalous.

Brian Brushwood Nine days until National Opt-Out Day. Just for one day, try it.

Leo Laporte Let’s go and do it.

Brian Brushwood It’s really, really awkward and I mean that’s my policy every time. I always refuse the x-ray and it’s all in principle, it’s like, no, I’ll get naked right here, if you dare me. But it’s on principle, it’s like I don’t like the invasion of privacy, it’s not the government’s job to be checking out my junk.

Leo Laporte So let me understand. So we are allowed to refuse the X-ray?

Brian Brushwood You always are, any day of the week.

Leo Laporte And if the alternative is a manual scan.

Owen JJ Stone You can’t refuse the pat-down.

Leo Laporte You have to get something.

Xeni Jardin I’d like to say – so I’ve actually been refusing the scans since they introduced in airports that I fly into and out of pretty regularly. And I was having dinner with a friend last night and she said, it’s interesting to note that the people who are really, really upset about the pat-downs like emotionally involved and how upset they are, tend to be more guys than women. And I think they are plenty of theories that you can throw out as to why that’s the case, but ….

Owen JJ Stone I was worried about getting excited.


Leo Laporte No. I can see that. Male or female, I can see people being very sensitive to it. And I tell you, if you had ever been abused or manhandled, it would probably be very triggering to that. It would not be a pleasant scenario.

Owen JJ Stone Two months ago, a woman broke down, triggered something.

Xeni Jardin I will also say that before the so called more thorough or more extreme pat-down techniques were put into place, I never felt like I was being groped inappropriately. It just – it felt a lot more desirable than going through that scanner for sure. Because I don’t know what happens with the images and I don’t everything about the technology behind the machine. I think that our country and our airports and our air travel business could do much better with more intelligent security. But that being said, I’m not looking forward to flying the next time I have to fly. Because it sounds like things are just so much more invasive, unnecessarily invasive, and I don’t feel safer.

Owen JJ Stone And I was like on a 5-day period, I’m like, I wore clothes 5 days ago, it’s like, they just set a new rules this weekend. I’m like, wow.

Leo Laporte I am flying in a couple of weeks, so….

Owen JJ Stone Go naked.


Leo Laporte I am going to France. You know it’s different in France. The French would give you a cigarette after they pat you down?

Brian Brushwood That’s right.

Leo Laporte I want to take a break. We have a great cast of characters here. Brian Brushwood from; Ohdoctah, JJ, Owen JJ Stone; John C. Dvorak. From, Xeni Jardin. It’s great to have you all. This is a good conversation. We will continue it in just a moment, but I want to remind folks that we couldn’t do the show without the help and support of our sponsors including the good folks at Citrix. Actually, this is a really good time, because you don’t have to go anywhere with GoToMyPC. You just stay home, just stay home.


Owen JJ Stone No more flying.

Leo Laporte GoToMyPC is actually awesome, whether you’re a traveler or you just – for the holidays it’s great time to take advantage of GoToMyPC and their free 30-day offer, you go home early, you could stay at home, you can – if you do go over the river and through the woods to grandmother’s house, you can also use it there.

Here’s what you do. Right now go to It will take you about 30 seconds to install on your computer. Now wherever you go, Mac or PC, you log in to secure – got to go to your PC and there’s your computer’s full screen, just like you are there. You can send and receive email, run any program full speed, access any network resource just like you are there. It’s really fantastic. I want you to try it free for 30 days.

I see you nodding, Brian. Do you use it?

Brian Brushwood Oh. I do. And here’s what I’d like to say, because first of all, most of the people who are listening who have tried GoToMyPC automatically went ahead and bought it, right? Because it’s obviously, it’s amazing and if you buy a whole year at once, you get such a crazy discount, you’re insane if you don’t buy it. But there’s a bazillion people who think they will never need to use GoToMyPC. Wait until you are out on the road and there’s are some files you need and you’re trying to walk you wife through the steps to find the file and email it over to you.

Leo Laporte I have done that. I have done that.

Brian Brushwood I’ll tell you. When you hit that situation and you will, just in the back of your head just, remember promo code twit. GoToMyPC you can direct – all she has to do is go to, download the client and they you take over, and she thanks you. She goes back to whatever that she is doing. It has saved me so many times I can’t even count.

Leo Laporte It’s great. Thank you, Brian. So we’ll stay a little bit with Facebook; we didn’t really resolved this email thing but we’ll come to it tomorrow at 10 a.m.

Owen JJ Stone I think we know now, we don’t want to use it. Bottom line.

Leo Laporte Bottom line.

Brian Brushwood We’re the grumpy old men in the background.

Owen JJ Stone Thank you. I don’t know what it is. I don’t like it though.

Leo Laporte Did you see? I thought this was kind of interesting. The kids are a little smarter maybe than we are. They are doing the super log off now when they….

Brian Brushwood I never heard of this until I saw this article. This is amazing.

Leo Laporte When they don’t want – let’s say they are going to apply for a job or for whatever reason they don’t somebody searching their Facebook profile, maybe you’re applying for a job in law enforcement. You delete your profile, but it doesn’t happen immediately, you have a few – I think there’s two weeks before it’s actually deleted. In that time, it’s not searchable, it’s not visible, no one can see it, it’s as if you don’t exist. You do the interview, you do the job, you get the job, you get in school, whatever it is you’re doing, and then you reactivate your account and you’re back to normal. Clever.

Brian Brushwood This is brilliant. This is why you can’t beat the kids. This is why your parental controls are all B.S. The kids will – nature will find a way. Jurassic Park all over again.

Xeni Jardin And that is why we have to get rid of kids.


Owen JJ Stone I was so in love with you till 22 second ago.

Leo Laporte You know, actually it’s encouraging because it shows to me at least those kids are sensitive to these issues and are thinking about it.

Brian Brushwood You know what it reminds me of? It reminds of – in Nineteen Eighty-Four, Winston has this realization that he could be a criminal and corrupt the institution, and he runs into Julia, who Julia grew up in this oppressive world.

Leo Laporte Right. She’s totally…

Brian Brushwood So to her like, oh, no, no, of course we all say we’re virgins. By the way, you want to go have sex.

Leo Laporte Right.

Brian Brushwood And it’s like – that’s what I feel like is happening here.

Leo Laporte It’s sad, repression does breed that kind of thing. It’s kind of too bad. Or I guess this is a weird form of repression.

Brian Brushwood Well, I mean, it’s a – the article, what I like about the article is that it pointed out is that this is mainly a symptom of the fact that privacy controls are too confusing with Facebook.

Leo Laporte Right. Nobody knows.

Brian Brushwood This is a brute-force solution to deal with it.

Leo Laporte I don’t even think it’s confusing. I think it – maybe that’s it, but I think also people don’t trust them…

Brian Brushwood Yeah.

Leo Laporte …because they change.

Brian Brushwood Absolutely.

Leo Laporte So you could it set private.

Owen JJ Stone You know what? It’s free. That’s what you get when things are free.

Leo Laporte It’s free.

Owen JJ Stone If you want more of something, pay for it.

Leo Laporte Should the Queen have created a Facebook page?

John C. Dvorak No.

Owen JJ Stone No.

Leo Laporte Apparently a mistake, because immediately people signed up for her Facebook page and started inveighing against the monarchy and calling her names.

Xeni Jardin Why do we care? We fought a war against these guys like 200 years ago.

Brian Brushwood Yeah. I’m with Xeni here. I want to ask John why should she not have, because you respect the throne so much? I mean, what’s the point? It’s like who cares, no.

John C. Dvorak No, because it’s stupid. I don’t think anyone should have a Facebook account, why should she? She’s not going to be on it. That’s bogus, that’s just a lie, another lie from the monarchy. You don’t think she ever looks at it, do you?

Owen JJ Stone He is fired up today.

Brian Brushwood But like the monarchy is silly. It’s silly to have a king ruling over.

John C. Dvorak Then it’s even more silly that she has a Facebook account, then.


Leo Laporte I think it makes perfect. It’s straight out of Terry Gilliam. Of course, she should have a Facebook page, and you should all go there and poke her.

John C. Dvorak Right away. Can I ask a question of the group?

Owen JJ Stone Yes.

Leo Laporte Yes.

John C. Dvorak How are you doing with that bottle of rum? Let’s see the level. Come on.

Owen JJ Stone All right.

John C. Dvorak No I want to – I’ve got to see the bottle. Oh you guys aren’t even – in about an hour you’ve got to finish it. Come on.

Brian Brushwood All right. All right.

Leo Laporte I am not having anymore.

Owen JJ Stone Oh please!

Leo Laporte Already I’m in tears.

Owen JJ Stone Uncle Leo just called out donkey love, so he’s done. As soon as he said donkey loved him, I wasn’t pouring him anymore.

Leo Laporte Already I’ve been in tears twice in one fight.

Amazon pulls the pedophile book after first defending it. Now this is an interesting story. It was self-published. I don’t – it’s disgusting. I mean, that’s…

Brian Brushwood Can we just all agree…

John C. Dvorak I think it should have its own Facebook page.


Owen JJ Stone It has like three Facebook pages against it.

Leo Laporte Apparently it does. Actually apparently…

Owen JJ Stone With thousands and thousands of people against it.

Leo Laporte Yeah. So Amazon at first – when people said, what – said – what did they say? They defended it as free speech issue?

Brian Brushwood Yeah, what they said was – and I’ll try to find the exact quote here, but essentially what they said is, look, we are not in the business of censorship, we let everything – let me get the exact quote here…

Leo Laporte Amazon it is believes it is censorship not to sell certain books simply because we or others believe their message is objectionable.

John C. Dvorak What does that say, it’s hilarious.

Leo Laporte Yeah. Amazon does not support or promote hatred or criminal acts, however, we do support the right of every individual to make their own purchasing decision. Isn’t that though what the first Amendment says is that we defend your right to say it however reprehensible?

Owen JJ Stone There’s general rules in society, and even criminals in jail don’t – you don’t mess with kids. You can rob a bank, you can murder an adult, but you do not mess with children.

Leo Laporte I know that from many a prison movie.

Owen JJ Stone Pound it out.

Leo Laporte Pound it out – pound it out, baby.

Brian Brushwood Here’s the thing. That sounds like a hilarious…

Xeni Jardin Why am I here?

Leo Laporte That’s because we love you, Xeni. Just jump any time.

John C. Dvorak Fist bump when you want.

Xeni Jardin Okay.

Leo Laporte Do you feel left out, Xeni?

Xeni Jardin To me, the most reprehensible thing here is not the fact that this book existed. I mean, welcome to the internet. The internet has bad things on it. Nor is it the fact that Amazon finally decided to pull the book, the Kindle book, the digital book from its shelves. There’s plenty of other stuff that they don’t sell. There are other – you know, they don’t – they pulled pornography from the Kindle bookstores as well. But the really reprehensible thing here was what certain blogs that – at least from my end shall remain nameless – did to bring as much traffic and faux concern trolling controversy as possible out of this. Sort of series of outraged editorials that were totally hollow, the same kind of stuff like, you know, Anderson Cooper having Dr. Phil on to talk about the ravages of pedophiles on the internet. You know, I don’t have the stats in front of me. But I think all the reports that are out there show that children are so much more likely to be sexually assaulted by a parent or another family member or a friend of the family than they are from some strange guy on the internet selling the Kindle book.

Leo Laporte. Right.

Xeni Jardin And I got good news for you. This guy had sold like one copy before TechCrunch and these other blogs got on it and everybody whipped themselves into a frenzy and it was on FOX, it was on CNN – come on.

Brian Brushwood Xeni, I love you.

Leo Laporte So what do you do though? I mean, Amazon did both – did everything, so they – guaranteed that there is something wrong because they did everything, they defended it then they pulled it. So…

Brian Brushwood Well, okay, well, keep in mind, the defense was a policy. And that policy got a big laugh from everyone, because we were talking about a book about pedophilia. But if it was a policy about violent video games – read it again and think about violent video games, read it again and think about The Anarchist Cookbook, read it again and think about Catcher in the Rye – any number of books that we’ve all decided that should be out there, and it doesn’t sound so silly. Now in this case it was a nothing book that was going nowhere that was written by a crackpot and possibly a criminal…

Leo Laporte So you agree with Xeni that the real culprit here is TechCrunch and the blogs that made hay on this?

Brian Brushwood I think we are the enemy here. I think we’re all a little piece of the rabble rousers and I think Amazon had a good policy…

Leo Laporte So Amazon should not – they pulled – they pull stuff – they pulled pornography, as Xeni pointed out. I mean, should they not pull anything?

Brian Brushwood No, no, no. Okay. First of all, it’s not a hilarious policy, I think it’s a sensible policy. But that’s not what happened here. What happened here is we all gathered around with our pitchforks and our torches and we started marching towards Amazon and Amazon did the one thing that makes sense in the whole world, which is yank this thing right off the top.

Leo Laporte But – yeah, understanding that this is considered to be one of the most reprehensible crimes you can commit.

Brian Brushwood Of course, of course.

Owen JJ Stone If it wasn’t that, that’s the difference in it. That’s why I said like, I understand your point.

Leo Laporte But they pulled books on how to cheat on tests. They pulled books on pornography.

Brian Brushwood I guarantee they don’t do that on principle, they do that because they see some pitchforks coming.

Leo Laporte So wasn’t it – I mean I’m playing devil’s advocate – but wasn’t it appropriate for people who discovered this book to say, well, hey Amazon, you have an inconsistent policy, is this not a reprehensible act, should you not pull this book? Xeni, I mean, doesn’t that seem like a sensible thing to raise?

Xeni Jardin Yeah, I don’t understand why it was there in the first place because they refused to sell titles that are far less offensive that have nothing to do pedophilia, they were just about like sex or whatever.

Leo Laporte So why is it inappropriate for TechCrunch to bring this up and say, well, look you got a crazy policy and why are you defending this book which is horrible?

Xeni Jardin Look, there is a difference between raising a concern over something that’s a real threat and then just fapping traffic, and that’s kind of how it felt.

Leo Laporte Okay. That’s legit.

Brian Brushwood I was so worried about how the story --

Xeni Jardin And interestingly too, Apple has a very different policy in their book store. And a lot of times people give Apple a lot of grief for having a very restricted policy. I don’t think that this would have happened in the Apple book store. I don’t think that this would have happened in the Apple app store.

Leo Laporte I think this is a very difficult thing for all these companies because they don’t want to set themselves up as arbiters because that’s a dangerous policy.

Xeni Jardin That system can be gamed.

Leo Laporte Yeah.

Owen JJ Stone This is like on YouTube when porn goes up you giggle like, oh how does this porn get slipped out. Well not enough people clicked on it and said this is violating whatever, this is disturbing to me.

Leo Laporte Wouldn’t the most sensible policy be, anything goes, this – we don’t – we’re not going to censor at all.

Brian Brushwood This is --

John C. Dvorak No.

Leo Laporte Why not?

Xeni Jardin I don’t know, you know, it’s a lot like comments, right. So with Boing Boing for a long time we had wide open comments, anybody could post any comment they wanted. While we were a smaller blog, that made sense and that wasn’t a big problem. But as Boing Boing grew and the size of the network – the size of the community involved became exponentially larger over the years, that open policy, we hit a point when it was no longer sustainable. We cut comments down altogether and we replaced them with a system where we have real live human moderators, you could say – I wouldn’t say that they are curetting comment, but if someone suggests something – you know, if somebody were to suggest an illegal act like this, we take a look at that and think like is this harming the community, is this potentially harming someone, is it a personal threat to one of the editors, is it something that makes us log on in the morning and feel really uncomfortable, does it improve the experience for us and for our community or does it degrade it. So it’s a little bit different but we…

John C. Dvorak I think in a nutshell, that’s exactly the answer to your question. That’s why anything can’t go, that’s why you took comments off your blog Leo, because if anything goes, you end up with this chaos, this chaotic mess that like Xeni said is – was ruining the experience. And you can’t do – you can’t allow it.

Leo Laporte And by the way, I have comments on my blog. We took comments off the TWiT webpage. But this a very difficult thing that all internet publishers are dealing with right now. Either you do what moot did at 4chan and say, do whatever you want.

Brian Brushwood Right.

Leo Laporte And you see what happens at 4chan. Or you try to do what Boing Boing did, and I think Boing Boing has done it very sensibly, but you’re also – Amazon is in a difficult position because --

Xeni Jardin Sure. Yeah.

Brian Brushwood And for what is worth, let’s make it very, very clear, this is --

John C. Dvorak No they’re not. What’s difficult about seeing a book on pedophile and saying, hey this book sucks, get it out of here. How difficult is that?

Leo Laporte No, that you shouldn’t have let up, I agree.

Owen JJ Stone I’m giving John a pitch for it. But you got it right after the show.

Leo Laporte But you do have to make difficult decisions in many cases about --

John C. Dvorak But this is what --

Leo Laporte I mean would you put, let’s say, a white supremacist book up there?

John C. Dvorak Me?

Leo Laporte Anybody.

Brian Brushwood See, it’s always the pedophiles first, and the racists second.

Owen JJ Stone I’m okay with – I’m okay with --

Leo Laporte These are both extremely reprehensible things but at the same time --

Brian Brushwood Yes.

Owen JJ Stone I’m okay with racism over pedophilia. Pedophilia, they’re children, they’re innocents. Adults have the right to do what they want to do, they are adults. This is America, as long as --

Leo Laporte So I’m just pointing out --

Brian Brushwood Racists have the right to lynch whoever they feel like because they’re adults?

Owen JJ Stone No, you have the right to [multiple speakers] (44:10).

Brian Brushwood Alright, but well let’s say the book was going how to lynch people.

Owen JJ Stone Well, then you need to read it and find out what’s going on.

Leo Laporte No, no, no, no, no, let’s just say Mein Kampf, because it’s racist, but it has – it’s a great – it’s an important historical document.

Xeni Jardin I was hoping you’d bring up Nazis.


Leo Laporte Yeah, where is Hitler.

Xeni Jardin It’s the drinking game.

Leo Laporte Godwin’s law, once again, well that’s why they call it a law because it may not be violated.

Brian Brushwood Sooner or later. But here is what I like about this discussion is that all of this is happening on the Internet with private individuals running their own little fiefdoms, I mean there is, or not fiefdoms I guess individual city states. You guys know I’m an unapologetic, one of those misty eyed libertarians and the Internet is the closest things that exists to a libertarian, anarchical society and it’s great to see everybody handle this universal problem in their own individual ways. And yes, Amazon’s grappling with it, they have their own unique take that they are dealing with it, but I think – it’s not the government –

Leo Laporte It’s something that we all have to deal with and this is a very difficult challenge. Some people have taken comments off their blogs, some people moderate comments, some people let anything go. I think 4chan is a really good example of what happens when anything goes.

Brian Brushwood That’s – talk about warts and all. I mean that’s like you look at pure honesty from --

Leo Laporte I think it’s great that 4chan exists. I went to see /b/ the other day, just because I’ve never been. And my wife was, I was in bed, I don’t know what was I thinking.


Brian Brushwood This is going down badly.

John C. Dvorak Have another drink Leo, come on.

Leo Laporte And of course I’m sitting here going oh my, oh my, and my wife looks over and she doesn’t – there’s no way to say oh no, this was a – what – there is no answer for this!

John C. Dvorak ‘I’m reading the articles, honey!’


Leo Laporte Seriously I think so I’ve never been there, I was just curious what happens there and of course I got caught immediately because that’s how I am. Now of course now 4chan is right now DDoSing tumblr which is DDoSing back, I don’t even understand what that’s all about. Is 4chan a blight? I mean – or is it just a good place to have some of these people go?

Owen JJ Stone I guess we need an evil empire. Better to have them in that little pool then running the streets.

Leo Laporte I think even moot is embarrassed sometimes on what’s going on here, but I commend him for embracing openness.

Brian Brushwood And unapologetically. I mean no compromise as far as --

Leo Laporte No compromise. No compromise.

Owen JJ Stone Especially when the Internet is everybody wanting to be nice to everybody. There’s like a whole nicety moving where people feel like they ought to be nice, which means they’re fake and they lie to people’s faces all the time. There’s not that much brute force honesty out there, people just are being real with each other.

Xeni Jardin What, are we reading the same websites, dude?

Owen JJ Stone Hey, of course there’s websites out there that aren’t. But I mean there’s a lot of grandstanding when you’re on the Internet and people don’t want to say anything about people and it’s weird. I’m talking about person to person.

Xeni Jardin Man I don’t know where you’ve been hanging out lately –

Owen JJ Stone I’m not talking about company and business; I’m talking about people.

Xeni Jardin I think I need to spend more time --

Owen JJ Stone You should hang out with me. Let’s hang out.

Leo Laporte The Internet is a broad and a varied place, I think we can agree.

Owen JJ Stone It depends on where you’re at.

Brian Brushwood Chatroom has a very specific request. They’d like to see us get away from pedophilia, bestiality, drugs, pornography, alcohol, Nazis and start on religion.

Leo Laporte Oh, good choice.


Owen JJ Stone Show’s over. Show’s over.

John C. Dvorak And by the way I want to apologize to the chatroom, it keeps crashing and so I’m not on it anymore.

Brian Brushwood Okay.

Owen JJ Stone Somebody cut the power off.

Leo Laporte What is the most taboo topic, is it religion?

Brian Brushwood You know what, I think it’s talking about how many employees Amazon is going to hire for this big Christmas season coming up.

Leo Laporte 15,000 isn’t it? Something like that.

Brian Brushwood Yes, yes. It’s insane.

John C. Dvorak What a segue. Awesome.

Brian Brushwood And in fact –

Leo Laporte He’s good. He’s good. He’s rather proud of that.

Brian Brushwood Specifically, and the number that stagger me of course Amazon has a lot of people coming in, but everybody does and I’m going to try to track down the actual number here, retailers will add between 550,000 and 650,000 jobs this holiday season according to an updated forecast from National…

Leo Laporte But, excuse me, are we still in like a economic crash, isn’t unemployment almost 10%.

Owen JJ Stone I’m wondering who is going to spend this money. Wasn’t – weren’t sales down last holiday season?

Leo Laporte They were.

Brian Brushwood Oh yes, dude, money’s going somewhere.

Leo Laporte Amazon said this is more than we brought in last year.

Brian Brushwood Yes.

Owen JJ Stone And sales were down last year.

Leo Laporte And sales were down last year but they for some reason think that it’s going to be a banner year.

Brian Brushwood Here’s my theory, little bit of – it cold be totally bogus. Let’s say money is tight, if money is tight and you want to stretch your Christmas dollar the farthest you possibly can, you’re going to get up and drive out to the mall and pay retail prices or you’re going to go online, plan in advance and figure out how to get the most for your bucks, and if you’re going to do that where are you going to spend it.

Leo Laporte I did see a survey, might be a little bit of dancing on the Titanic, but I did see a survey that said that people – middle-income people are going to spend less. It’s the wealthy who plan to spend more this year. So the people who have money are going to spend more of it this year…

John C. Dvorak Oh well, that’s interesting because I’m angling for somebody to give me a MacBook Air for Christmas and I know that they are loaded.

Leo Laporte Oh, shut up.


Owen JJ Stone Well, I’ll make sure Uncle Leo has all our addresses, and if you’ve been a good boy John, I’m sure it’ll be true for you.

John C. Dvorak I’m not saying who.

Owen JJ Stone Uncle Leo of course, who else? That’s where I got this one from. Because I’m not giving it back.

Brian Brushwood I mean, I don’t want to jump ahead on stories, but didn’t Google have like some big significant story that happened this…?

Leo Laporte Let’s talk about that. That is actually a holiday, a holiday – festive holiday story.

Brian Brushwood It was a bit of a surprise at the Google didn’t they?

Leo Laporte Well, what’s interesting – well, I’m going to save it because I want to mention Squarespace quickly and then we’ll get to it.

Brian Brushwood Oh, my goodness. I almost had an ESP moment. When we were talking about DDoS, I almost said and I didn’t know who was coming up next after the break, I was going to say do you know who couldn’t be DDoSed?

Leo Laporte That’s a good point. One of the things I love about Squarespace they use that Java virtual server technology. I don’t really fully understand it but when you go to a Squarespace site you are not going to just one server you are going to an amalgam of servers and as bandwidth is required Squarespace responds. Paul Thurrott’s been having such trouble with his website, the SuperSite for Windows and I keep saying Paul just sign up on Squarespace, just do yourself a favor. Squarespace: the secret behind the exceptional websites is both hosting and software, really exceptional content management system running on Squarespace.

All you have to do is go to and take a look, start with a template, 60+ plus designer templates, but then the beauty of it is you are not stuck with a cookie cutter site because immediately you can start customizing it to your heart’s desire and I mean really customizing it. Squarespace gives you the chance to make a unique site, looks like a professional did it but it’s just drag and drop mouse plex. If you know CSS of course you could do even more, but you don’t have to, you really get a lot of control over your site. So start with a great template. You can import your existing content very easily. Squarespace has importers for all the major blog and website APIs including movable type, WordPress TypePad and Blogger.

You know the easiest thing to do go to and click the green button, try it for free right now. All you have to do is give them a site name, a password, an email address so you can recover the password if you forget it, do a little captcha here. No credit card nothing, you’ve got 14 days to play with Squarespace and really see what you like Alex was telling me the other day he was in a restaurant that didn’t have a website so he started – he went to set up a website and said here, here’s the password if you decide you want a website I’ve done like 90% of the work for you while I was eating lunch. It’s that cool; it’s that slick; it’s that easy to use. I want you to give it a try. If you go to do the two-week – please, do the trial. We arrange with our – all of our advertisers for trial so that you can try before you buy. We know you’re smart. We’re not trying to sell you a pig in a poke, it’s best to try it first, but if you decide you like it, sites start at $12 a month, that’s hosting, software everything, very secure because they do the updates regularly. And if you use the offer code TWiT you’ll get 10% off that price for the life of your site.

Many great sites use Squarespace. If you want a tour go to the examples page at and see all the fantastic sites. Squarespace, lot of photographers, great portfolio templates, lot of non-profit. We thank them so much for your support.

So if you worked at Google and you were a very nice engineer and you said I am going to take a job at Facebook, they might offer you $3.5 million not to.

Brian Brushwood What, is that what happened?

Leo Laporte Yes. We – the other story that I know you were thinking about was a --

Brian Brushwood It’s a lesser story. But I want to hear about this one, $3.5 million.

Leo Laporte Well, this is the interesting thing, the guy who leaked the memo about the 10% raise and the $1000 bonus to all Google employees was fired immediately.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah.

Brian Brushwood Merry Christmas.

Leo Laporte Merry Christmas.

Brian Brushwood Yeah.

Leo Laporte Fired immediately and Google made a point of saying we fired that guy.

John C. Dvorak Hey, wait a minute, hold on a second Leo. There is no reason for privacy or all this other crap what difference does it make if he leaked the memos, everything’s open, everything’s free.

Leo Laporte Well, alright let me put it this way, if you’re going to leak a corporate memo don’t use your Gmail account to do it.

John C. Dvorak Changing his tune.

Leo Laporte Might have been a little bit of a mistake.

Brian Brushwood Did they really expect that not one person would say by the way I got a $1000 bonus or by the way --

Leo Laporte Apparently they thought that that – it said on the memo confidential Google only and I guess they took it pretty seriously.

Brian Brushwood Wow.

Owen JJ Stone They got upset because it becomes a story, anything Google does becomes a story.

Brian Brushwood But that’s such a positive story.

Leo Laporte It’s a good story. Don’t you want that story?

Brian Brushwood Google loves its employees.

Leo Laporte $20 million it’s going to cost them to give every employee $1000 about as a $1 billion give 10% raise and now we are finding out that the 10% raise is only for the supernumeraries, executives get 30%.

Brian Brushwood Wow. Maybe that’s the part they didn’t want out, executives getting 30%.

Leo Laporte And this guy – now, I don’t know how true this is, but this guy is they say $3.5 million so he wouldn’t go. There’s a big brain drain. Google’s loosing a lot of people to Facebook.

Brian Brushwood This isn’t the same guy they fired, which is the guy that that...

Leo Laporte Wouldn’t that be funny if Larry Ellison offered him a job?

Xeni Jardin Did you guys read that thing this week about how Google is basically hiring servants for their employees –

Owen JJ Stone What?

Leo Laporte Oh My God!

Xeni Jardin To do things like clean the cat litter box or…

Owen JJ Stone Are you serious? Where is that article?

Xeni Jardin …or fold your laundry or go home and turn your compost pile whatever it is that people do up there in Silicon Valley where you guys are.

Leo Laporte Wow. I know at the Googleplex they have a dry cleaning thing, so you just drop off your dry cleaning.

Xeni Jardin Yeah but they’ll – this is actually like servant labor that you can just give them; you have credit points that you can cash in and ask these people to –

Leo Laporte I love it.

Brian Brushwood You love it? This sounds like slavery, Uncle Leo.

Leo Laporte No, it’s – no, no wait a minute, wait a minute. Slavery? These people are getting paid right?

Brian Brushwood Shillings.

Xeni Jardin They’re being paid, yeah.

Leo Laporte It’s a job, Owen.

Xeni Jardin It’s sort of like mechanical Turk but for physical tasks that involve your house.

Leo Laporte Are you saying there should be no menial jobs, Owen?

Owen JJ Stone I am just saying a megacorp shouldn’t have kitty litter in the office that needs to be turned off by office janitor.

Leo Laporte Well I don’t know if it’s in my office.

Xeni Jardin It’s not in your office, it’s just like back at your home.

Owen JJ Stone Oh it’s a home service?

Xeni Jardin Yeah. Or wherever you want.

Owen JJ Stone I just need to go get a job at Google, apparently.

Leo Laporte Well, so these people work for Google but they can be like checked out like a library book.

Brian Brushwood Yeah, it sounds to me like –

Xeni Jardin They are contractors, so it’s a service; I’m blanking out at the name of the service.

Brian Brushwood It sounds to me like this is a timeshare for –

Leo Laporte Servants.

Brian Brushwood Yeah, well not – yeah servants –

Owen JJ Stone Servants is a bad word.

Brian Brushwood For cleaning service or --

Leo Laporte Speaking of which you see that Ask Jeeves is going out of business?


Brian Brushwood Is it, is Ask really? Is it all the way down? I just drove by there the other day.

Leo Laporte Yeah, it’s all over for They’re folding up the…

Brian Brushwood We get the answer, thank you Ask.

Leo Laporte They say we can’t compete against the Google.

John C. Dvorak Wow.

Leo Laporte It’s of course, what’s his name from ICM?

Xeni Jardin Yeah.

Leo Laporte The big guy, can’t remember his name, who bought them and said well we thought at the time that Google was perhaps --

John C. Dvorak A fad

Leo Laporte A fad, right for the taking, anybody could beat them.

Xeni Jardin Oops

Owen JJ Stone Well they never offered any other services like Yahoo! Has --

Leo Laporte Oops.

John C. Dvorak I’ve been looking at Blekko and I like it.

Leo Laporte I like Blekko, I don’t like the name but I like Blekko.

Brian Brushwood What’s that? How do you spell that?

Leo Laporte It’s – they’re calling it slash tags.

Brian Brushwood And so what do you do, how do you use Blekko, I am here right now.

John C. Dvorak You use it like Google, but I mean, it has these slash tag angle and it gets you slightly differently results but it doesn’t get you worse results.

Leo Laporte So the idea would be for instance I have created a couple of slash tags myself, there is one that’s a slash a – Tech news and there is one the slash TWiT. So I will do is search let’s say for Google and instead of I will say Google slash Tech news and then it uses my sources and my sources only for the search, so that it will search through my canonical Tech news sources. So I’m only going to get Google tech new stories. Similarly if I use slash TWiT it would only be cases where people with, like you Brian with your blog or anybody would somebody who works for TWiT mentions Google. So I think that that’s kind of a --

Brian Brushwood So you have to customize, you have to setup your own flash.

Leo Laporte This is why it’s a flop. Because you have, you can find other people’s slash tags, but it’s too much work.

Owen JJ Stone We are lazy.

Brian Brushwood But is it the kind of thing where they just haven’t built the right vocabulary of slash tags like eventually like I just typed in x-ray back scatter slash right and I am not getting anything interesting.

Leo Laporte That’s good. Yeah because there is no slash right.

Brian Brushwood Right, but are these universal backslashes that people can set up or --

Leo Laporte Well users set them up and apparently they have got a vocabulary you can follow users. It’s a kind of a social, it’s too much work. It’s too much work

Brian Brushwood It’s too much work, yeah.

Owen JJ Stone Look over your shoulder.

Brian Brushwood Cthulhu is back

Xeni Jardin What are you talking about?

Brian Brushwood I saw you.

Leo Laporte Cthulhu.

Brian Brushwood I can see you.

Xeni Jardin I totally agree that slash tags are fascinating. What?

Leo Laporte Exactly.

Owen JJ Stone You should be here and have some of this and bring the yellow thing.

Xeni Jardin Okay. Send your limo.

John C. Dvorak Hey, how you guys doing on that bottle?

Leo Laporte Look she looks just like that. Yes same thing, wait a minute, go ahead do it Xeni, let me just dissolve the two --

Brian Brushwood Yes. Separated at birth.

John C. Dvorak Isn’t this the character that’s on the Futurama show?

Brian Brushwood Yeah it does kind of look like that.

Owen JJ Stone Dr. Zoidberg.

John C. Dvorak Dr. Zoidberg that’s who he looks like.

Owen JJ Stone Is Dr. Zoidberg Cthulhu?

Brian Brushwood No, he’s the lobster man.

Leo Laporte Alright enough foolishness.

Owen JJ Stone Then we should end the show.

Brian Brushwood So we sort of jumped ahead right here but there is some other big news --

Leo Laporte There is no order. You think there is order. There is no order.

Brian Brushwood We were going in order but --

Owen JJ Stone This is sheer chaos, right.

Brian Brushwood Call of Duty shatters videogame sales records.

Leo Laporte $360 million for one day.

Brian Brushwood And you know what’s great about this release.

Leo Laporte This is Call of Duty black ops. With no offense, Owen.

Brian Brushwood That’s – oh my god, I looked at Owen for the comment, and it’s Leo with the steal.

Owen JJ Stone Hey, I’m waiting for white ops to come out before I cause a stink.

Brian Brushwood Okay, but the thing with Call of Duty black ops is that the…

Leo Laporte Can I have some more?

Brian Brushwood It had been the case where Infinity Ward was the quote-unquote “the real” developer for Call of Duty. And then –

Leo Laporte And then they all walked out.

Brian Brushwood No, no, no. And then Treyarch would be the – at bat. Whenever they had a – after they had a major release, Treyarch would come in and do a – let’s cash in.

Leo Laporte Would [Indiscernible] (59:10) Infinity Ward do Modern Warfare 2?

Brian Brushwood That’s where things got interesting. For me personally as what I’d like to think a relatively hardcore PC gamer I really disliked Modern Warfare 2.

Leo Laporte Really?

Brian Brushwood Well, Modern Warfare 1, Call of Duty IV was very, very clever, it had an engaging story and a big twist that really hit you in the gut and it was believable and I loved every minute of it. Infinity Ward’s next release Modern Warfare 2 was just silly. It was a Michael Bay movie. Now for some people Michael Bay movie means a good thing, ‘I’ll go see Transformers II.’

Leo Laporte Right. Right.

Brian Brushwood Me it’s just silly and it’s like, I don’t care, everyone’s made of rubber. And so what’s interesting is, Treyarch kind of stepped up. They wrote an interesting story for this one, I still haven’t played, I’m looking forward to, this is all hearsay from where I am coming from, but I am looking forward to do it. But it would be interesting if Treyarch stole some of the geek cred on this title. Well I’ll wait for all the reviews to see exactly where it is.

Owen JJ Stone I feel the exact opposite of Brian.

Brian Brushwood All right, you like Michael Bay.

Leo Laporte You like Modern Warfare 2?

Owen JJ Stone Yeah I like, I like Infinity over the other one. And I feel like the other Call of Duty is living off the lure of Modern Warfare. So the game play is different. Forget the story, I play it for the multi-user, online experience of killing my friends. The story is the story, you play through it in a day and then you get online for months and year at a time waiting for the next Call of Duty to come out.

Brian Brushwood And that is true. If what you want is – and for that…

Owen JJ Stone So that’s what most people play it for. And to kill other people.

Brian Brushwood And for that – the most significant difference is the new Black Ops has dedicated servers and Modern Warfare 1 did not, that was a big deal.

Leo Laporte That was a big issue, wasn’t it?

Brian Brushwood It really, really was, because it was very easy to hack.

Leo Laporte You know though, I mean 360 million in one day, whatever you say, Modern Warfare 2 obviously was so successful that the sequel was huge and bigger than any – now – and by the way, a movie is 10 bucks, this game is $60.

Brian Brushwood Yeah

Leo Laporte Nevertheless bigger than any other entertainment first day in history.

Brian Brushwood But the level of experience you get is so much more immersive with a videogame.

Leo Laporte No I’m just talking about raw dollars.

Brian Brushwood Right.

Leo Laporte Obviously you get more for 60 bucks.

Brian Brushwood Of course.

Leo Laporte But you can’t say $360 million because that’s really you know 60 times 60 or whatever it is.

Brian Brushwood Now on the flipside, we have $360 million, very big number. There is another Microsoft number maybe not so big, I don’t know…

Leo Laporte You know I am not sure because Microsoft has not said how well, and this Windows Phone 7 I gave one to Owen.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah, and I think I kept it, did I not give it back?

John C. Dvorak Is that a gift?

Leo Laporte Gave is the wrong word. I loaned it.

Owen JJ Stone No, no, no you said gave. We already have…

John C. Dvorak I heard gave.

Leo Laporte I temporarily.

Owen JJ Stone It’s okay, I paid you for this.

Leo Laporte Oh, god.

Brian Brushwood This is all going downhill.

Owen JJ Stone Which one do you want?

John C. Dvorak Hey, let’s talk about that Windows Phone 7. Unfortunately, I’m not there. I would have been.

Leo Laporte I like it, I like it.

John C. Dvorak But – yeah, do you?

Leo Laporte Yeah.

John C. Dvorak I mean seriously?

Leo Laporte Well, okay, here is my thought on it, and Owen you can maybe corroborate or deny. But it’s – you know this is the same hardware as you are going to get in a Samsung Galaxy S phone running Android essentially. It’s a gigahertz processor, very good camera by the way. I would say as good as the iPhone camera, 5 megapixels, very good camera. I think very intuitive simple operation.

Owen JJ Stone Very intuitive and smooth.

Leo Laporte Very – oh, the first thing you feel is this is responsive.

Owen JJ Stone Way more than Android. Like I’d have that over an Android. I’d still have my iPhone first…

Leo Laporte Well, if all you care about is responsiveness, yes.

Brian Brushwood Yeah.

Owen JJ Stone Well, I can flip through, I can find everything, it was nice.

Leo Laporte And I gave this to a couple of people with no smartphone experience and that was my interesting observation is they quickly grokked this. There is a lot of little things…

John C. Dvorak They grokked it, did it break?

Leo Laporte They grokked it. They understood it John.

John C. Dvorak Oh.

Leo Laporte And I think that what I am seeing is Microsoft’s strategy and ad campaign now makes kind of sense. This is a phone for non-smartphone users. Feature phone user who want a smartphone and I think they are less intimidated by this and it’s a little easier to use. And I think Microsoft is smart because 80% of all phone users are still using feature phones.

Owen JJ Stone It’s the best smartphone they have ever made.

Xeni Jardin I would agree with that, I had lunch with Wilson Rothman formerly of Gizmodo now with MSNBC, couple of days before the device came out. He had an early review unit and I liked it. I was – I was all primed to hate it but it felt like..

Leo Laporte Me too.

Xeni Jardin …all of the nice things about the physical UI of the Zune, seriously don’t laugh at me because…

Leo Laporte No, I’m with you, we agree.

Xeni Jardin …the Zune had kind of nice physical UI but with – like they really got the software right. They really got the flow of usability right. Or righter than they’ve ever had it before.

Leo Laporte It’s a remark, it’s a very non Microsoft product. It’s remarkably nice.

Xeni Jardin Yeah, it’s still Microsofty.

Leo Laporte Yeah.

Owen JJ Stone Yes, if it was something else I’d have been like oh this is the greatest thing in the world, when it’s Microsoft you already tickled the grain of salt, and you’re like okay, then you touch it, like wow this is nice.

Brian Brushwood In fact I don’t even think of it as a Microsoft phone, it’s so much as a Zune phone.

Leo Laporte Yes it is. It’s really what it is.

Brian Brushwood I mean this is an extension of what they were trying to do when they started the Zune campaign.

Leo Laporte Yeah. Now to be fair, Microsoft had the advantage of watching Android in Apple...

Brian Brushwood And waiting yes.

Leo Laporte …and waiting and they had three years to look at what everybody is doing, so they benefited from that. But they did some things differently.

Owen JJ Stone They still kind of messed it up.

Leo Laporte Oh boy, we know that. I mean, to me this is what webOS should have been. With the Palm Pre should have been.

Xeni Jardin Yeah.

Leo Laporte If they had given the Palm Pre this much performance, it would have been a much more successful phone.

Owen JJ Stone And everything – you had a lot of pictures on it, everything was loading like extremely fast…

Leo Laporte Yeah, it’s very snappy.

Owen JJ Stone …the way I thought it should be.

Xeni Jardin Yeah.

Owen JJ Stone …like even the pictures and everything.

Leo Laporte But Xeni, Xeni you wouldn’t buy one I bet you.

Xeni Jardin I might, yeah.

Owen JJ Stone Buy me one too.

Leo Laporte You would trade in your iPhone for this?

Owen JJ Stone Christmas, Amazon.

Leo Laporte And, I’m just guessing you’re an iPhone user.

Xeni Jardin I’m an iPhone user but I’m thinking about having a few and using them regularly in ways that I haven’t during review periods. Because I’m interested to see if part of my evaluation of different mobile devices has to do with just the learned familiarity that we get when we sort of fall into familiarity with one brand.

Leo Laporte I’m with you 100% this is why I buy.

Xeni Jardin So yeah, I might. I mean, I’m trying to be objective.

Leo Laporte Yeah.

Xeni Jardin I love my iPhone big time but I’d like to make sure that I’m doing due diligence on maintaining an open mind.

Leo Laporte This is why I buy phones and I use them because two weeks is not enough, a week is not enough.

Xeni Jardin No.

Leo Laporte You’ve got to use it for a few months and you got to bite the bullet and use it.

Brian Brushwood Because you – you hated the keyboard on the iPhone to begin with and it was until..

Xeni Jardin I can’t review things just by looking at the box, you know I’m…

Leo Laporte By the way yes John said he was going to explain that to us.

John C. Dvorak Yep.

Leo Laporte How do you review things by looking at the box?

John C. Dvorak You can look at the box a lot of times and the way that it works is that it is a moment of gestalt. Sometimes, in the olden days when there was actually a lot of software flowing around, you had to look at a lot, but you didn’t have time to boot a loot and you have to make a decision on whether you want to review this, and you could tell by the box many times whether it was a piece of crap because the box just looked like a piece of crap, there was misspellings on it, their listing of what it did and didn’t obviously do anything. It was poorly designed, it had bad vibes on the box.

Leo Laporte All right. Let’s test this.

John C. Dvorak And so it was..

Leo Laporte John I’m going to show you a box and you tell me, you give me your review of this device, you’re ready?

John C. Dvorak Yeah.

Leo Laporte Here it is, this is the box there it is, it’s square.

Brian Brushwood It’s got stuff flying out of a screen. Leo Laporte Got stuff flying.

John C. Dvorak I’d have to – that’s a box that is fairly neutral to me, it’s like somebody was over designed by some art department and it doesn’t really tell me anything, there is nothing written on it, I’d have to open that box up and actually look at the product.

Leo Laporte Owen give me the thing.

John C. Dvorak So minimalism sometimes pays off when it comes to the choices.

Leo Laporte It does.

Owen JJ Stone Give me the phone.

John C. Dvorak But when I open the box I could take a look inside quickly glance through the book, it might be, I may or may not like the product.

Leo Laporte Right. Here’s what’s inside.

John C. Dvorak Wow, how did you get it out of there, it’s amazing.

Leo Laporte Yeah, yeah. You know cell phone companies by the way…

John C. Dvorak It’s a giant phone.

Leo Laporte The boxes are very primitive. This is the Samsung Galaxy Tab. And actually, you know what? Somebody has been playing Angry Birds on it.

Owen JJ Stone Not me, it wasn’t me.

Leo Laporte I was told by a number of people, oh it’s terrible, the applications don’t scale properly because it’s a 7-inch display, it’s running Android. You know what? They scale beautifully, and this is actually extremely usable.

Owen JJ Stone Do you have black banana?

Leo Laporte And a pretty darn good device. I think this is a good competitor to the – Xeni have you played with any of the Android tablets yet?

Xeni Jardin Yeah, I am excited about the…

John C. Dvorak This is the dumbest game I’ve seen.


Xeni Jardin I’m hypnotized by your…

Leo Laporte Oh, John, I beg to differ, this is Fruit Ninja I’m playing for those of you listening.

Xeni Jardin As if it’s a vegan game.

Leo Laporte It’s vegan, no fruit will die – will be harmed in the – well actually all of the fruit will be harmed.

Xeni Jardin So you are making smoothies with all of that.

Leo Laporte Yes, of course it’s delicious and they’ve fruit facts in between. Now this is a non-vegan game, because you’re killing pigs. Angry Birds. So, I have to say, this is actually quite impressive to me. I think that this shows that Android even though Google has said 2.2 is not really a tablet OS, this is running 2.2, not Gingerbread 2.3. I’ve to say I’m very impressed by this.

Brian Brushwood Now, did you start with very low expectation, so that’s why you’re..

Leo Laporte Yes, I’d read reviews of this that said you know it’s a terrible device, oh come on…

Brian Brushwood He’s going to smile at you…

Leo Laporte There you go.

Brian Brushwood Oh, you got him, okay.

Leo Laporte I got him. By the way I just want you to know that was an amazing shot.

Owen JJ Stone I know that was a professional shot.


Leo Laporte Pause for a moment and say that was completely serendipitous. I’d..

Brian Brushwood New high score, congratulations Leo.

Leo Laporte I had no idea what I was doing.

John C. Dvorak You were like a pro playing that thing.

Leo Laporte Maybe I played a little too much of Angry Birds. But this ensures me that there is going to be some competition for Apple in this tablet space. I don’t think a Windows tablet will do it but Android actually does pretty nice actually.

Brian Brushwood That’s what is exiting it’s like the biggest step is from..

Leo Laporte He wants it back, he wants it back.

Brian Brushwood And this is true of anything, when you’re opening a new market. The biggest step is from zero successful devices to one successful device, and the second biggest step is from one to two, and from here is where it explodes and you get kinds of different devices that caters to …

Leo Laporte We saw that with the iPhone, didn’t we?

Brian Brushwood Exactly, exactly. And so just as the iPad, I mean, I’ll admit I was very skeptical of the iPad as a device that people would keep on them and use and obviously it was a big, big hit, and I own an iPad now but I suspect looking at this device that this will be better because I do take this ridiculously big laptop with me, If I’m going to take a small, I don’t want to take a full iPad and this giant laptop but something like the Galaxy will be fantastic.

John C. Dvorak You know the thing you want to take, let me just give you some advises, the MacBook Air. That device is the winner.

Leo Laporte I’d have to say…

Xeni Jardin It’s pretty sweet, the new one is pretty sweet.

Leo Laporte It’s really sweet. In fact a Consumer Reports..

Owen JJ Stone I’m taking that home with me.

Leo Laporte ...which is no Apple fan, they still have – they still are telling people not to buy an iPhone 4 because of the antennae issues, say this is the best laptop they’ve ever tasted. This is better than anything they’ve ever tested.

Brian Brushwood Looking at this MacBook Air…

Xeni Jardin I think they tasted it, they licked it all over.

Leo Laporte They licked it. Isn’t that what Steve Jobs said, it’s a lickable interface, I think he said that about the iPhone.

Brian Brushwood A friend of mine, the fantastic magician and consultant Andrew Maine who writes…

Leo Laporte If that disappears up your sleeve, you’re in deep trouble.

Brian Brushwood Well he did a whole hour long talk. He did a whole hour long talk talking about the principles that are used in magic and illusion and how Apple is a wizard of co-opting them, because if you look this is a deceptive base, so when you look at it head-on…

Leo Laporte It looks thinner than it is, yeah.

Brian Brushwood You only see this edge on both sides, now meanwhile obviously it gets thicker at the back and if you look at this, it looks more like a regular laptop they’re accustomed to.

Owen JJ Stone No.

Brian Brushwood What do you mean, no, get out.

Owen JJ Stone It’s half the laptop that I’m regularly accustomed to.

Brian Brushwood No, well I think it looks just like this one. I don’t see what the difference is at all.

Owen JJ Stone This is the Owen laptop, this is the Brian laptop.

Leo Laporte What an illusion. I got to tell you that Brian Brushwood has the largest laptop I have ever seen in my life.

Owen JJ Stone Yes.

Brian Brushwood Thank you.

Xeni Jardin More to love.


Brian Brushwood That’s what I’ve been telling people for years. That’s my line.

Leo Laporte Yeah. Wow. So Xeni what do you think of these Android tablets? How many have you played with – have you played with the ARCHOS or…

Xeni Jardin Yeah, I mean, just briefly, I haven’t taken one home for a longer kind of test drive. You know, again, I’m not a big fan of that really brief embargo review period charade that we all have to go through.

Leo Laporte I don’t do it.

John C. Dvorak We don’t have to go through it.

Leo Laporte I refuse.

Xeni Jardin Oh, you don’t have to, but you…

Leo Laporte You do it because you…

Xeni Jardin …you have that option if you want to get the early review.

Leo Laporte But – and you do – you’ll be called upon on, on the day of release by networks and CNN and ready to review it. So you – I understand why you would be and you’re interested, get it a week or two early.

Xeni Jardin Yeah.

Leo Laporte I wish…

Xeni Jardin You don’t have to do any of this.

Leo Laporte Right.

Xeni Jardin But that’s the game as it exists, and I don’t like that. I feel like…

John C. Dvorak I don’t blame Xeni, it’s corrupt.

Leo Laporte Well, it’s corrupt because people like Mossberg and David Pogue have seem to have an monopoly on this, Xeni you’ve gotten pretty good I think in getting on this list. Have you not?

Xeni Jardin I didn’t do anything. I just…

Leo Laporte But no, I know you didn’t, because I – you have absolute integrity…

Xeni Jardin I didn’t change it.

Leo Laporte …but don’t you see how it implies? It implies some sort of relationship and you have to be – you end up being defensive about it.

Brian Brushwood And super defensive because you don’t want to screw it up at the same time.

Leo Laporte No, and that’s why I’m very proud…

Brian Brushwood You don’t want to ruin it, right?

Leo Laporte …to cheese off Apple whenever possible, because I don’t want to be – perception is important in this as well, and I don’t want to be perceived as – and I have been in the past perceived as an Apple fan boy.

John C. Dvorak Can I interrupt?

Leo Laporte Yes, John C. Dvorak.

John C. Dvorak Isn’t it also – haven’t you actually because of your high road that you’ve taken Leo, you’ve been banned from Apple events.

Leo Laporte Stop. Stop, you just needled me.

Brian Brushwood Cut to the photo. Cut to the photo.

John C. Dvorak No, it’s the fact.

Leo Laporte No, in fact, I mean, even in more trouble, I don’t want to say why but I’m actually even in more trouble.

Brian Brushwood Let’s just say, someone won’t be showing up on the Person of the Year list anymore.

Leo Laporte Hey, let’s talk about that.

Brian Brushwood Yeah.

Leo Laporte Time Magazine Person of the Year – now see they did this before, they’ve put it online for votes, but they – obviously they have no intention of pay any attention to the vote.

Brian Brushwood No.

Leo Laporte In fact number one right now, would you read that name Brian Brushwood because I tried to and I couldn’t.

Brian Brushwood You know what I could not and I had and sadly I didn’t even recognize him on the face…

Leo Laporte Apparently, the Prime Minister of Turkey.

Brian Brushwood Yes. But I guess…

Xeni Jardin Oh, I love that guy.

Brian Brushwood Let me find the actual article.

Leo Laporte You know who he is Xeni?

Xeni Jardin No!


Owen JJ Stone No. It’s funny, Leo was not looking at her face at all, it’s like you know – I love that guy.

John C. Dvorak I find that whole thing weird that they were choosing it, because he is actually the kind of the leverage against the original Ataturk...

Leo Laporte Is he a Muslim? Now remember…

John C. Dvorak Yeah, he is a Muslim fundamentalist when it comes down to it.

Leo Laporte But do you remember that Time Magazine, Person of the Year is not in fact a good person necessarily, Hitler has been chosen, it’s merely the most important person of the year. Now, what was interesting is Marissa Mayer on a panel said, it should be, I think she’d say, Eric Schmidt, Larry Page, she said Steve Jobs. She said he’s made a big difference.

John C. Dvorak She was almost – you know the story was told, he was picked as Person of the Year 1982 or whenever when they made the computer the Man of the Year, or the Person of the Year.

Leo Laporte Right.

John C. Dvorak Steve Jobs was original choice and he turned out to be such a – apparently, a jerk to the Time Magazine people that…

Leo Laporte Oh, what a surprise.

John C. Dvorak …they pulled it. You’ve heard the story from Steve, from Wozniak.

Leo Laporte I have.

Brian Brushwood So they have an online voting system at right now and Steve Jobs is currently number 7 with 10,000 votes. That’s one tenth of the current number one, which I’m going to make a bid for this one: Recep Tayyip Erdoğan.

Leo Laporte That’s why I made you say that.

Brian Brushwood I don’t know.

Owen JJ Stone Recep Tayyip Erdoğan.

John C. Dvorak Where’s Leo?

Leo Laporte I’m not on the list. Lady Gaga is number 2.

Brian Brushwood Lady Gaga number 2.

Leo Laporte This is why Internet…

John C. Dvorak Oh there you go. That tells you everything you need to know.

Leo Laporte Yeah internet poles don’t – Julian Assange, I think you can make a good case for this guy. He’s the creator of WikiLeaks being certainly the most – one of the most important people of the year.

Brian Brushwood I would say he certainly is the person who in that same spirit of for good or for ill, for kind of like Hitler making the list, I am not saying he is Hitler, but the point is he is like someone who…

Xeni Jardin So Julian Assange is Hitler?

Brian Brushwood No, oh come on stop that.

John C. Dvorak Yes.

Brian Brushwood But for someone who affected the headlines of the year I would say this is my pick. Julian Assange.

Leo Laporte Yeah. Glenn Beck, Jon Stewart, and Stephen Colbert.

Brian Brushwood They’re neck and neck in votes.

Leo Laporte Then in number 6 position Barack Obama, then in number 7 position Steve Jobs. Number 8, The Unemployed American.

Brian Brushwood Boy, you really got that one on the history books?

Owen JJ Stone That’s what I want. I want The Unemployed American.

Leo Laporte I’m voting for the Chilean miners.

Brian Brushwood I just want the photo to be a guy on his couch.

Owen JJ Stone I want him to be on the street forget a couch.

Leo Laporte I think it should be Ohdoctah.

Owen JJ Stone Yes, The Unemployed American of the Year.

Brian Brushwood Are you going to start campaigning for The Unemployed American?

Owen JJ Stone Sure. I’m going to not work for like next month and a half.

Brian Brushwood And then after that is just like the Chilean miners.

Leo Laporte I think the Chilean miners are good. They didn’t do anything, they were just stuck in a hole.

Brian Brushwood Well, I mean, can you name any of their names?

Owen JJ Stone They did their job poorly actually.

Leo Laporte They did.

Owen JJ Stone They caused the cave to collapse. They got to take the…

Leo Laporte But they did all right. They lived to tell the tale. They were on the Letterman show.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah.

Leo Laporte I think you could make a strong case for Mark Zuckerberg who is in the top 20. He’s number 12.

Brian Brushwood You know what, I did like that.

John C. Dvorak I got one.

Leo Laporte Okay.

John C. Dvorak And it’s not on the list or someone, Tim Lincecum.

Brian Brushwood Who’s that?

Leo Laporte He’s the Giants’ baseball pitcher who beats your Texas Rangers.

John C. Dvorak Who said who’s that? Who said who’s that?

Brian Brushwood Ohdoctah said that. Ohdoctah said that.

John C. Dvorak Guess where he’s from. Guess where he’s from.

Brian Brushwood Ohdoctah said that.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah I said that, and say something else John, say it, I dare you.

John C. Dvorak Wow!

Owen JJ Stone Leo cut his mic, do it. I – look, look you are not in the studio I will say anything I want to you right now Mr. Dvorak.

Leo Laporte So are you a Phillies fan, oh no you must be a Yankees fan.

Owen JJ Stone I’m a Phillies fan.

John C. Dvorak No he obviously doesn’t know anything about baseball.

Owen JJ Stone I’m a Phillies fan. Look…

Brian Brushwood Actually.

Owen JJ Stone Look.

Leo Laporte It was the greatest World Series ever.

Owen JJ Stone At least our team lost to the team that was…

Leo Laporte It was so close to a sweep, John.

John C. Dvorak Yeah.

Leo Laporte Lincecum was dominant but god you got to love Brian Wilson. Not the beach boy, the guy with the beard.

John C. Dvorak And the Mohawk.

Leo Laporte And the Mohawk. Yeah, I didn’t know there was a Mohawk under there until…

John C. Dvorak Oh yeah.

Leo Laporte But what’s this weird thing that Pat Burrell does, he dresses up in weird leather.

John C. Dvorak No, what’s – the first – is it Burrell that does that…

Leo Laporte It’s Burrell yeah.

John C. Dvorak Yeah, he wears the thong because apparently he was on a…

Leo Laporte No, no, no, no the thong, no, no, no, no, no, no that’s different. The thong…

Xeni Jardin It’s the airport security thing.

John C. Dvorak Well the thong guy is on first base, what’s his name?

Leo Laporte Yeah, yeah, the glitter thong guy.

John C. Dvorak Yeah glitter thong.

Brian Brushwood We’re not talking about Lady Gaga anymore?

John C. Dvorak I don’t know what Burrell does.

Leo Laporte Burrell, when Brian Wilson was on with Leno, Burrell comes – like sneaks out behind the set with a full S&M leather, half naked, more than half.

John C. Dvorak It’s the San Francisco Giants.

Owen JJ Stone What’s just happened here? I thought this was a tech show.

Brian Brushwood You know what we were classy up until this moment.

John C. Dvorak If you would know who Lincecum was, we’d on our way.

Brian Brushwood Actually that was – I am not going to lie, I am going to own up to this, I had no idea who he is, I don’t follow sports, and so Ohdoctah took the bullet…

Leo Laporte Mark Zuckerberg, I think Mark Zuckerberg would be – don’t you think he’s made a significant…

Owen JJ Stone And he has got a movie out I heard. He’s got a movie out.

Brian Brushwood Certainly he is the tech person of the year, I would give him that instantly, but I think I would give it to…

Leo Laporte More than Steve Jobs?

Brian Brushwood More than – not more – yes, yes, I would say more this…

Owen JJ Stone How many people on Facebook again?

Leo Laporte 500…

Brian Brushwood Half a billion.

Owen JJ Stone Didn’t they have a movie?

Leo Laporte Yeah.

Brian Brushwood Well the movie…

Owen JJ Stone New story?

Leo Laporte The movie, don’t do the movie. I think Mark – what do you think Xeni, of these people who would you say is the person of the year?

Xeni Jardin Eh. I don’t know. I don’t even know how important those lists are, I don’t see a woman – it kind of bumps me out that the only female name that you mentioned there I think probably the only one on the list…

Leo Laporte Sarah Palin.

Xeni Jardin …is Sarah Palin and Lady Gaga…

Owen JJ Stone That’s embarrassing.

Brian Brushwood Nancy Pelosi is on there.

Xeni Jardin Why can’t we have like one woman who like wears pants to the office and does something interesting with science and technology…

Leo Laporte I know, Hillary Clinton.

Xeni Jardin …and get recognized.

Leo Laporte Yeah.

Owen JJ Stone What woman would you suggest?

Leo Laporte I read a blog post which I thought was really right on about Wired Magazine, and I…

Xeni Jardin Yeah that was interesting, there were some interesting stuff that came out of it too.

Leo Laporte I hadn’t really thought about that, but once – I am going to try to see if I could find it, but basically her point was that Wired covers are misogynistic.

Xeni Jardin Well, okay, the point she was making was that the magazine hasn’t had a woman on the cover just for like straight up science and technology and she has been since I don’t know, 1996 with Sherri Turco, I think that was it?

Leo Laporte Right, right.

Xeni Jardin And like there has been Martha Stewart and Sarah Silverman and some sexy covers with I don’t know…

Leo Laporte Well and the current cover which is…

Brian Brushwood The giant breasts.

Xeni Jardin Which is boobs, giant boobs.

Leo Laporte The story is about tissue engineering it has nothing to do with boobs, but the cover is cleavage.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah.

Xeni Jardin Yeah.

Leo Laporte I mean it sells, look – it sells magazines, you can’t..

Xeni Jardin When I first saw it I just thought they must be really desperate to flog the print sales, the print sales must not be doing well, and I think it’s – you know it’s definitely fair to have this discussion but it’s unfair to single Wired that is the only publication that suffers from a lack of smart females on the cover.

Brian Brushwood What, give me a couple of women that should be woman of the year just so I can get educated also.

Xeni Jardin Look, I mean it’s not my job to like pick out.

Brian Brushwood Yeah.

Owen JJ Stone Oh, I know, I know. It’s not your job. I was just asking in general like – you know – because Sarah Palin is obviously is a joke.

Brian Brushwood But I think her point is TIME’s job is to let us discover --

Owen JJ Stone Sure.

Xeni Jardin Yeah.

Brian Brushwood People who we didn’t even know should be the person of the year.

Owen JJ Stone Yes.

Brian Brushwood And it would be nice if more of them were women.

Owen JJ Stone Because half the people on the list, most people don’t know.

Brian Brushwood Correct.

Owen JJ Stone So I got your point.

Leo Laporte I think if they are the legitimately the person of the year, it’s not going to be somebody you never heard of.

Brian Brushwood Well, let’s say, for example, let’s say, there was an issue and for example, I didn’t recognize – I forgot that Julian Assange was the guy who did WikiLeaks.

Leo Laporte Right.

Brian Brushwood I have heard WikiLeaks all year long from multiple giant stories.

Leo Laporte Here is the blog post, Cindy Royal, Cindy’s Take on Tech. There’s the Wired cover, the current Wired cover. And I thought this was such a great post. Dear Wired: I feel like I’m in an abusive relationship with you. I love you. You’re charming, attractive, and smart, everything I would ever want in a magazine. Most of the time, you are harmless, and I tell everyone I know how awesome you are. But every now and then, you slip, and you make me feel very bad.

And then she’s done a good job of putting together Wired covers. There is the Sherry Turkle cover. Here is Laurie Anderson. But those were more than a decade ago.

Brian Brushwood Well, no, no, pan down. That’s not a sexualized cover with Sarah Silverman on there. I mean if it’s – and that’s not a sexualized cover.

Xeni Jardin But the point is that Sarah Silverman isn’t running a technology company, like she’s a comedian. She’s an actress. They’ve had actresses and models and – people like that on.

Leo Laporte What about Caterina Fake? Why shouldn’t she be on the cover?

Xeni Jardin I don’t understand why she --

Leo Laporte Yeah, I mean there is a lot of examples and actually Cindy in her blog post refers to quite a few of them. I think this is a legitimate question to pose. Now admittedly, Conde Nast is the publisher. I mean this is a – this is exactly the kind of stuff Conde Nast, I am sure, does on. Don’t they publish Cosmopolitan as well? I mean there is a lot.

Brian Brushwood Oh, is that the sexy publication?

John C. Dvorak Hearst owns Cosmopolitan.

Leo Laporte Hearst owns Cosmopolitan, right. Well, they publish similar kinds of magazines, I am sure.

Xeni Jardin Well it’s part of why I love what we do on Boing Boing because we don’t have to worry about pushing a certain number of copies of a dead tree issue with every story that you write.

Leo Laporte Right.

Xeni Jardin And we’re able to cover people and things and ideas that maybe aren’t on the top of the heap yet. We’re able to pursue things that fascinate us. And I think that it’s not diversity by design but it does end up yielding more of a diversity of participants in that conversation.

Brian Brushwood Well, if we can swap roles and I can play devil’s advocate here, and I am very sympathetic to the point, I would be interested to know – I guess to know whether or not there is an unfair bias, we would have to know because it’s very specific, it’s clear you want women in technology or in science to be on the cover but I would imagine out of all the topics they cover on Wired that that is a much smaller under-represented --

Leo Laporte Well, she makes the point that when Wired did a major story about Caterina Fake who founded Flickr, she wasn’t on the cover, Will Ferrell was on the cover. And that sells magazine. Now, Xeni, you are actually I think being a little self-deprecating because this is the dead tree issue but plenty of blogs do exactly the same thing.

Xeni Jardin Sure.

Leo Laporte To generate traffic and it’s to BoingBoing’s credit that you haven’t succumbed to that kind of...

Owen JJ Stone It’s the same thing as people say all the time, oh, there is no black people in the space. Well, when African Americans, whatever, make awesome products and the cream rise to the top, there will be some.

Xeni Jardin Right.

Leo Laporte But here is the deal. Wired is arguably the journal – one of the journals of record of the tech industry as all the other paper magazines have fallen by the wayside. If you’re going to encourage more women to get involved in tech, you’re going to put, you’re going to exalt them at least once in a while so that there is some sense that there is a position, there is a role for women in tech that it’s not just Sarah Silverman, Martha Stewart and Pam from The Office that count.

Xeni Jardin Yeah.

John C. Dvorak You guys can talk blue in the face about this. This is very – in big magazines, especially groups like Conde Nast --

Leo Laporte I know, I know.

John C. Dvorak They study this to death.

Leo Laporte They know what sells.

John C. Dvorak They roll out one of these issues with somebody you want on the cover.

Leo Laporte Yeah.

Owen JJ Stone Yup.

John C. Dvorak And the cover drops dead on the newsstands and the guy who is doing the covers gets chewed out and so he goes with what sells.

Leo Laporte Absolutely.

John C. Dvorak I mean that’s what it boils down to.

Leo Laporte No, of course, it is.

John C. Dvorak You can’t complain about it.

Owen JJ Stone That’s why I don’t have the argument when people tell me, oh, there is no – blah, blah, blah, people of color.

Leo Laporte It’s our fault, it’s our fault.

Owen JJ Stone I am like, okay, well, if you want more people of color, there will be more people of color.

John C. Dvorak It’s the public’s fault.

Leo Laporte If we bought the magazine with Sherry Turkle on the cover --

Owen JJ Stone Exactly.

Leo Laporte Daniel Boyd on the cover.

Owen JJ Stone But it’s not what we want apparently and when we want it, we’ll get it.

Leo Laporte It’s the same, people have complained about how crappy TV is. Right?

John C. Dvorak It is.

Leo Laporte It’s crappy because people watch it.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah.

Leo Laporte So stop complaining.

John C. Dvorak Yeah, Kardashians, there is your example, says it all.

Leo Laporte Yeah.

Brian Brushwood All right now, there is one item that I wanted to make sure we did talk about and I don’t know how much time we have left but holy cow --

Leo Laporte What time is it? Okay, we got time.

Brian Brushwood We got time, good.

John C. Dvorak It’s 7.

Brian Brushwood Holy cow, did I --

Leo Laporte The bottle is not empty. We got time, dude.

Brian Brushwood I absolutely love Xeni’s post about Damn You, Auto Correct. That is the greatest website on the Facebook planet.

Leo Laporte It is so funny.

Xeni Jardin It’s the best.

Leo Laporte I meant to read this on the radio show because everybody identifies with this. Tell us about this, Xeni.

Xeni Jardin Yeah, so there is a blog where somebody has been capturing screen grabs of really embarrassing or funny auto corrects that happen on different smartphones where people are texting back and forth to each other. The one that I think grabbed for BoingBoing was somebody said, I reached a really, really high level of anal birds.


Leo Laporte Oh, my god.

Brian Brushwood Oh, my god.

Leo Laporte OhDoctah, OhDoctah.

Brian Brushwood OhDoctah just spat out a galaxy.

Leo Laporte We [ph] got to spit take out (85:44) a galaxy.

Brian Brushwood OhDoctah just spat out a galaxy.

Leo Laporte And I missed it, damn. That’s why we need an actual director.

Xeni Jardin The first time I saw the site I think I was --

Leo Laporte Spit-taken?

Xeni Jardin [Indiscernible] (85:57).

Leo Laporte It’s really, really, really great. But aren’t they all the iPhone? Let’s face it. This is the iPhone.

Xeni Jardin I think a lot of them.

Leo Laporte Yeah.

Owen JJ Stone Oh my God!

John C. Dvorak Yeah, it’s all Newton technology apparently.

Leo Laporte Yeah. Here is somebody – I guess I lied earlier, I feel pretty good right now. Is that because you took something? Not yet, I ate something and did some humping jacks. Bible study on the 19th; I could probably do the 11th. Since I have this Friday off, I will need all my spareribs for school next week, I am traveling.

Brian Brushwood So we made a game out of this on NSFW last week.

Leo Laporte Did you?

Brian Brushwood Yeah, what we did was we gave you the conversation without telling you what the real word was. So you had to read the conversation and based on what people said, you had to figure out what the actual word was. In fact, I just posted in the document under – right next to Xeni’s post there – I assume this is where I posted, I don’t know. But basically, we would read it out and then you had to guess like --

Leo Laporte What they meant?

Brian Brushwood Exactly.

Leo Laporte All right, here’s one, here’s one. This is from Missy.

Brian Brushwood Okay.

Leo Laporte OMG, that guy I slept with at NYU is here where Alexa and I are. Ah! Hook up with him! Hangman, Mo; Hangman, Mo. She meant to type ha, ha, ha, ha, no.

Brian Brushwood Oh, okay.

Leo Laporte But she typed Hangman, Mo. This is great saying.

Brian Brushwood My favorite was like, oh, baby, when are you going to be over. And the answer was Zionism.


Leo Laporte I can’t even hold the scrollbar steady. Yeah, you guys have to come – oh, wait a minute, oh my god, okay. This is very funny. Good find, Xeni,

Owen JJ Stone And I just – I spat up all over your equipment.

Leo Laporte That’s okay. You not only watered --

Brian Brushwood He might as well. Just give him the MacBook Air now.

Owen JJ Stone Oh, true, it’s got my saliva on it. If you spit on it, it’s yours, right? Isn’t that the rule?

Leo Laporte You know, you can spit on the Galaxy Tablet if you want but keep you keep saliva off my --

Owen JJ Stone Okay, I’ll take the tablet. And you can have the laptop. Thank you.

Leo Laporte Oh, my god.

Owen JJ Stone I am sorry. I am so – it’s not my fault.

Leo Laporte So let’s look at those consumer review ratings because they are kind of interesting. Android pones big time across the board from Consumer Reports, they do – they give you – assign a numeric score, as anybody who reads Consumer Reports knows, to the phone. The number one phone according to their numeric score – and I don’t know, do we as tech people consider Consumer Reports a valid reviewer of tech objects?

John C. Dvorak No.

Brian Brushwood I do. In general, on balance, I have high faith in Consumer Reports and especially – maybe it’s because I believe in them for cars.

Leo Laporte I think they are very independent.

Brian Brushwood Yes.

John C. Dvorak I don’t.

Owen JJ Stone Of course not.

John C. Dvorak When PC Magazine in its heyday from about, let’s say, ‘89 to ‘90 – to 2000, let’s say, when we had this huge lab – but we still have a lab, but it used to huge when we used to go over every nook and cranny of every possible aspect of these computers that came in. And we compared them with the Consumer Reports version of these reviews and they were shallow. They were missing the point. And they were largely wrong. I have never been a big believer in Consumer Reports after that.

Leo Laporte I used to choose shampoo based on Consumer Reports until my wife told me, those guys wash their hair with soap. You can’t listen to them. But let’s give you the ratings. The number one phone according to Consumer Reports, the Samsung Captivate with a 76, tied with Samsung Vibrant. I do like that GALAXY S platform. Then the DROID X just below it with 75 points, and the DROID2; the EVO with 74 points, the 3GS, not the 4, the 3GS with 74 points, and that’s because they don’t recommend the 4 still due to the antenna issues; the Aria with 74 points, the DROID Incredible with 73, the Ally with 72. These are all Android phones.

Brian Brushwood Okay, well, I think we are getting to the point where it’s – especially with technology, there are so many different aspects to it, it’s easy for Consumer Reports or for any review institution to look at numbers and say, well, this has two cameras and that’s clearly better than one camera.

Leo Laporte Right.

Brian Brushwood But it’s like – it’s how the device fits with you.

Leo Laporte And it’s really up to you.

Brian Brushwood It’s really the type of person. It’s how you feel about your phone. It’s what you are into. I am really surprised that the GALAXY took the top spot. That makes me – I got to admit I am a little bit Android curious these days.

Leo Laporte Ah, huh?

Brian Brushwood I want to try it out.

Leo Laporte Ah, huh?

Owen JJ Stone I got this one. We can play with it.


Leo Laporte Oh, stop it.

Owen JJ Stone I spit on it, it’s mine.

Leo Laporte I just have to say, I am very glad that there are many so good choices now. The iPhone dominated for so long.

Owen JJ Stone Options are better.

Leo Laporte I waited six hours in a line to get the first iPhone, and I love the iPhone, but I am really glad that the Android phones and frankly, the Windows phone, these guys have caught up. And there are some great choices out there. And that’s good to see.

Brian Brushwood Consumer wins.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah, when they have competition, they push each other, so that’ always a good thing.

Leo Laporte Yeah. We’ve lost your picture, Xeni. Are you --

Brian Brushwood She’s putting the fruit back on.

Owen JJ Stone Are you hiding from us? Come back. We love you. Don’t leave us.

Xeni Jardin Here am I again. I thought that you have banned me for --

Owen JJ Stone No, we’re going to give John a hug though. He needs a hug.

Leo Laporte You are funny. Don worry. He’s fun.

John C. Dvorak I do. I always need a hug.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah, you need a hug today.

John C. Dvorak I need a perpetual hug.

Owen JJ Stone Yes, because you are --

Xeni Jardin Perpetual hug machine; that should be the name of this --

Leo Laporte Yeah, John is in the cranky box, but you are in the funny box.

Owen JJ Stone Yes. Look at how happy she is. Look at John. Just, oh my god.

Xeni Jardin This is my XD face.


Owen JJ Stone It’s like night [ph] and day (91:18).

Leo Laporte All right, let’s take a break. We are going to come back with more. Xeni Jardin is here from; John C. Dvorak from Channel Dvorak. What is that John? Is that you?

Brian Brushwood Oh, my god, that’s John.

Leo Laporte Look at that. That’s his headshot from 19 --

Xeni Jardin He was even crankier when he was young.

Leo Laporte Is that a Ziff Davis?

John C. Dvorak That’s my – that’s what – I always went around like that.

Leo Laporte Yeah.

Brian Brushwood I totally believe that.

Owen JJ Stone He looks like a fish that got thrown back. He looks so – he is just --

Leo Laporte He’s still got the hook in there, haven’t you?

Owen JJ Stone You don’t – you didn’t want me, I am John C. Dvorak.

Leo Laporte That’s Owen JJ Stone, OhDoctah from; and Brian Brushwood from and Scam School.

Brian Brushwood Yeah.

Leo Laporte Are you out here to do shoots for Scam School?

Brian Brushwood Yeah, we just finished, three nights, Scam School.

Leo Laporte Some good scams, got some good scams?

Brian Brushwood Yeah, no, good stuff coming up.

Leo Laporte You want to share anything?

Brian Brushwood You know what? I may talk about it here after the break.

Leo Laporte All right, he left us a gallon of white gas.

Brian Brushwood Yes.

Leo Laporte So if we ever want to do any fire tricks.

Owen JJ Stone Burn [indiscernible] (92:12) down.

Leo Laporte Burn – that’s good. I was sad when Gil Scott-Heron passed.

Owen JJ Stone Yes, passing of people is always bad.

Leo Laporte Yeah. Hey, let’s talk a little bit about our friends at Ford. I was at the Ford plant at Dearborn. What a – I’m just really excited about what Ford is doing, bringing back the pride in America’s industrial power with some great vehicles including the new 2011 Ford Fiesta. You’ve seen the ads. I love it, the guy goes, it’s kind of a big thing. I love that.

EPA estimated 40 highway miles per gallon. And I got to tell you, look at the hybrids, look at – I mean this is --

Brian Brushwood Oh, I just realized you are talking about the Fiesta.

Leo Laporte This is the Fiesta. This is a gas engine.

Brian Brushwood Let me tell you they get it, they get it, as far as the [ph] connected populous (92:54) online.

Leo Laporte Oh, they sure do. Who was – I think it was Walt Mossberg was getting in one of the Fords. And he said for a long time driving a car, you are going back to the 19th century, you are disconnected from everything. But now with the Ford SYNC, the Android phone or the Windows phone or an iPhone, they were smart because they thought these technologies are going to advance faster than we can in the car. So what we will do is we will tie the car to your phone. We will use the pone’s capabilities and that’s where Ford SYNC really is exceptional.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah.

Leo Laporte It’s got 911. It’s just through your phone. If you’ve got a podcast or music, you can call for it by name through the phone. Both my Android phone and that Windows phone, the iPhone doesn’t do it, but will read you text messages. The whole idea is you want to keep your hands on the wheel and your eyes on the road but still be connected. So a message comes in, it goes ping, you got a text message. You press the button, it goes, well, it reads me something like those autocorrect messages. And it’s usually a cause for [indiscernible] (93:48) actually. I enjoy those text messages.

Brian Brushwood But it’s like they understand that – and obviously I mean I say obviously, but I assume that Fiesta is targeted especially at younger demographic.

Leo Laporte Yeah, it’s a less expensive car.

Brian Brushwood People who are highly connected, people who want fuel economy, they don’t want to spend a lot of money on car.

Leo Laporte Yeah, but you got to look at the Edge if you want a high-tech car. That’s aimed at the soccer mom and I mean that’s a beautiful car.

Brian Brushwood But the point is they want to get around. They don’t want to spend a lot of money. And they know that those are the type of people who are going to stay connected. And those are people who are going to be most likely to pick up their phone and check their messages which is --

Leo Laporte You know it’s cool. As I have my – my DROID X is my phone. So that’s tied to the Bluetooth. But when Henry gets in the car, he gets the audio via Bluetooth from his phone. I can do two phones at the same time.

Brian Brushwood Wow.

Leo Laporte So he can listen to his music while I make sure that my phone is the one that will ring.

Owen JJ Stone Sad note about Ford, outside of technology, right now I think they have a special on ABC or NBC, but it was just the story of how they didn’t take the bailout money.

Leo Laporte I know.

Owen JJ Stone How they struggled through that, and they found their way.

Leo Laporte They are profitable.

Owen JJ Stone And really [indiscernible] (94:48) through the technology but also just making a better car and they brought in the right people to have the resurgence. And it was actually pretty awesome, again, because they didn’t take that money that’s why I watched in the first place. But it was an awesome story.

Leo Laporte The story is kind of neat. And Alan Mulally, their CEO --

Owen JJ Stone [Indiscernible] (95:02)

Leo Laporte [Indiscernible] (95:03)

Owen JJ Stone Yes, it got such high ratings that they are going to play it a couple of more times.

Leo Laporte Their CEO, Alan Mulally designed the 777 cockpit.

Brian Brushwood Wow!

Leo Laporte He is a Boeing engineer. So this guy knows a little bit about technology. I mean he’s not – he is like pretty – we had a great talk with him at CES. I hope we can do that again at CES.

The 1 – I am talking about the Fiesta again, the 1.6 liter Duratec Ti-VCT I4 engine is very peppy. There’s little things too like the Easy Fuel capless fuel-filler. You don’t need to cap on your – I have that on my Mustang. The 4-inch multi-function display with LCD screen. Of course, the incredible Ford SYNC.

Take a look. Go to your local Ford dealer and drive one this week. It is a great car. Don’t forget the Edge as well if you are looking for a little more capacity. Great cars. I am very happy in my Mustang.

Brian Brushwood They are doing great ads too.

Leo Laporte I haven’t seen the ads.

Brian Brushwood They are all over the YouTube. And our friends over at Film Riot did a very funny one. In fact --

Leo Laporte I love that one. I saw that.

Brian Brushwood Oh, you did see that?

Owen JJ Stone I saw that, yeah.

Brian Brushwood They eventually released the ad by itself on YouTube. And it got like five times the traffic of the episode and I was [ph] ticked (96:06) because I was on that episode.

Leo Laporte Oh, no. Yeah, no, that – in fact, Ford shows that around as an example of how social media can do --

Brian Brushwood Oh, that’s awesome.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah.

Leo Laporte And new media can do great ads for products. Yeah, I’m really – I am actually thrilled that they sponsor podcasts. They sponsor a lot of podcasts.

Brian Brushwood Well, they get it. They get the technology.

Leo Laporte That shows a lot. I think that shows the one. So we thank them for their support. We encourage you to support them right back.

What do you think about this transit union chief in New York who is suing the Google because somebody was slamming him on a blog. This is another free speech issue.

Brian Brushwood If he’s going to do anything, slam the guy, why – I guess he is suing them so that --

Leo Laporte He’s suing the blogger because the blogger is on Blogspot and is anonymous. And so he says, I want Google to reveal this guy’s name. I mean it’s – this is those John Doe lawsuits, the music industry does them too.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah, pretty much.

Leo Laporte Should a blogger’s anonymity be preserved even in a case where the blogger is perhaps defaming somebody?

Owen JJ Stone Couldn’t a blogger just sign up with a fake name and stuff like that [indiscernible] (97:09) account. So --

Leo Laporte He did. So what they need to do is they need to subpoena Google for the IP address --

Owen JJ Stone Yeah. That’s a lot.

Leo Laporte I have actually gone through this with the Twitter and then you get the IP address. You know who the ISP is. You now second subpoena –

Brian Brushwood This is you tracking somebody down who is doing something?

Owen JJ Stone Yeah.

Leo Laporte Yeah, that’s right. And we then had a – then we had to go to the jurisdiction where the ISP is, another subpoena for the ISP saying who used this IP address at this time. We did in fact get a name and address and –

Owen JJ Stone Okay.

Leo Laporte Yes, but it’s a long process.

Owen JJ Stone It is a long process.

Leo Laporte There is a subpoena process. I presume Google complies with it. I think all Internet – what does Boing Boing do. You must receive occasional subpoenas.

Brian Brushwood Nasty [indiscernible] (97:50).

Xeni Jardin It happens. My only comment on this story is I am delighted that we are not at the receiving end of the subpoena this time.

Leo Laporte Fair enough. The guy – the head of the New York City transit union says the blog has repeatedly attacked him with false accusations of incompetence –

Xeni Jardin [Censored]


Owen JJ Stone That came up twice on this show. That’s twice.

Brian Brushwood That’s two. That’s two.

John C. Dvorak That’s the name of the show, Leo, the name of the show.

Leo Laporte Not that there’s anything wrong with that.

Owen JJ Stone Hey, Xeni, I thought you were born with this. You just came down to our level instantly. You are all above board.

John C. Dvorak Time for more drinks.

Xeni Jardin I am sorry, I was reading 4chan.

Leo Laporte Yeah, p/p, /p/. He’s going to go after a defamation lawsuit. But interestingly, Google has declined to comment and has not responded. But I think that this is kind of – there is a standard process for this. And I having been through this, most companies will not respond. They say you need an official of the court to come to our home.

Brian Brushwood And it sounds like a big deal when people sue. But the way everything’s set up, you need to sue in order, for example, for copyrights –

Leo Laporte This is going – that’s all it needs, you going to court.

Brian Brushwood Exactly. For copyright, you have to send a letter of cease-and-desist. And then you have to sue or else you release your copyright to it, right?

Leo Laporte Are you playing Tetris?

Owen JJ Stone No.

Leo Laporte Because apparently, playing Tetris reduces post-traumatic stress syndrome.

Brian Brushwood I totally believe this by the way. I totally believe this article.

Leo Laporte Why?

Brian Brushwood Well, because – well, first of all, I know this much, whether it’s Tetris, when I was deep into chess, I would sit down and close my eyes and I would just –

Leo Laporte You play chess?

Brian Brushwood And I would visualize night configuration.

Leo Laporte Yes, it’s very soothing.

Brian Brushwood Yes, exactly. And I still have it now. I am playing Drop7 on the iPhone. It’s my new addiction.

Leo Laporte Is it like Tetris?

Brian Brushwood It’s like Tetris. And I just picture the numbers dropping and forming – it’s where your mind goes on an idle cycle. And I would imagine if I have seen some horrific things that I would prefer my mind go to Tetris or to Drop7 or to Knight Moves then do those horrific things that I participated or so on.

John C. Dvorak What was that one game, night boobs?

Leo Laporte Knight Moves.

John C. Dvorak Oh, Knight, oh.

Owen JJ Stone You just need something to distract you. I don’t know so much of Tetris.

Xeni Jardin But you know the night boob.

Owen JJ Stone Yes, come down to our level, we are dirty and filthy.

John C. Dvorak [indiscernible] (100:05)

Brian Brushwood All I want to say is…

John C. Dvorak She isn’t even drinking.

Brian Brushwood All I want to say is…

Leo Laporte She is taking [indiscernible] (100:08).

Brian Brushwood Leo squinted and nor – or shook his head when John did it [indiscernible] (100:17).

John C. Dvorak Down it Leo, drink, drink, down it.

Xeni Jardin No, I actually did – it is…

John C. Dvorak Just down it bottoms up.

Xeni Jardin I don’t know much about the research behind it, but having played [ph] T-Roms (100:27) and Tetris in my life, it makes sense, there is a [indiscernible] (100:30) repetitive geometry, there’s this sort of [ph] Dwacky (100:34) meditative space that you get into…

Leo Laporte Zone out.

Xeni Jardin …you really move it on that game. You zone out. Yeah, and…

Leo Laporte Is it – do you think [ph] the equivalent of (100:40) meditation.

Brian Brushwood I do, I would totally believe that, it’s a state of low level self-hypnosis is what I could imagine in it as.

Xeni Jardin Yes.

Owen JJ Stone Yes, I’m with John on that, I don’t know about all that.

Leo Laporte No, no, we’ve all done it, don’t – isn’t that why we play video games, it’s not – it’s calming, even [indiscernible] (100:59)…

Owen JJ Stone It is [indiscernible] (101:00) but meditation is something different, meditation is you look in inside yourself and dealing with the things you have to deal with in your mind and that letting you to go [ph] mind listen (101:07) to a game and push buttons that distracts you.

Brian Brushwood No, no, here’s what it is, it’s like when you are in the world, you have so many different types of stimulation, you have audio, you have tactile, your visual, you got things happening, you have people talking to you and it’s like when you do something like Tetris, it occupies some of those inputs, so it’s like you’ve…

John C. Dvorak Hey, you’ve lost Leo, he is wandered off with the bottle…

Brian Brushwood He’s taken the booze out of here because we’re getting too real…

Owen JJ Stone Unless [indiscernible] (101:30) somebody with a system, so he doesn’t walk in or something.

Brian Brushwood That’s right.

Owen JJ Stone He’s been like – he’s walking around like Ray Charles right now, he can’t see anything.

Brian Brushwood But you’ve been there, it’s like when you get into a game and it’s like for example, my favorite game.

Owen JJ Stone I know what you’re saying – I’m just saying it’s different than meditation.

Brian Brushwood Yeah, for example, that’s why you can read Audiobooks while you’re driving a car. Or you listen to Audiobooks while you’re driving a car, because your hands are doing stuff, your eyes are doing stuff, your brain is doing stuff but then – you’re able to hear and listen, you have these different inputs and it ties it up, when you play a game like Tetris.

Owen JJ Stone Meditating is just to me…

John C. Dvorak Here you go.

Leo Laporte Even a Shooting ‘Em Up for me is actually fairly meditative…

Brian Brushwood Kind of call me, right?

Leo Laporte You need to focus, now I’m a very ADD person, so…

Brian Brushwood Really?

Leo Laporte Are you being sarcastic? When I was a kid and I didn’t – I was under [indiscernible] (102:14) ADD, I played chess and it was very soothing, in fact they say people with ADD hyperfocus and I think that maybe we are in a kind of almost – a condition of ADD in this society and that these games probably do help, people deal with the crazy society, that we’re…

John C. Dvorak I think that cooking is a better use of your time.

Leo Laporte Cooking situ.

John C. Dvorak And it’s also meditative.

Leo Laporte And you get food at the end.

Owen JJ Stone I’ve been cooking for a long time. And let me tell you…

Brian Brushwood See okay, we just have there different flavors at the same game.

Owen JJ Stone No, no, no.

Brian Brushwood [indiscernible] (102:39).

Leo Laporte Cooking not eating.

Owen JJ Stone What?

Leo Laporte Cooking.

Owen JJ Stone You can cook and not eat it.

Leo Laporte That’s a problem.

Brian Brushwood That’s why [indiscernible] (102:47).

Owen JJ Stone Exactly, uncle Leo.

Leo Laporte Cooking not eating. Netflix says, we’re not going to be on Android until they get a much more secure platform, we’re on iPhone, they just – in fact this is annoyed Android people know in because they announced it for Windows Phone 7, we’ve been waiting on Android [indiscernible] (103:07).

Brian Brushwood Do you really think that is Netflix position that they like to be in or are they being forced in that position by...

Leo Laporte The movie industry?

Brian Brushwood Yes.

Leo Laporte Yeah. They need a DRM solution, they say, I don’t know how would you steal a Netflix streaming movie, I don’t even…

Owen JJ Stone But I mean – was – is there – I don’t know…

Leo Laporte Yeah.

Brian Brushwood I mean capture the wrong – I mean, I would imagine…

John C. Dvorak It has a software to do it.

Leo Laporte Really?

Brian Brushwood Yeah.

Leo Laporte Murdoch to pull the plug on MySpace? Do you think?

Brian Brushwood I don’t know, I kind of wanted to make a pool along this one, you want to make a [ph] guess pool (103:37) from MySpace.

Leo Laporte He said, he was very grumpy. He was like John he said this thing is not making money…

Brian Brushwood He was like John.

Leo Laporte He was like John, he is not going to [indiscernible] (103:45).

John C. Dvorak Hey, these guys need to get out of here. Close the place.

Leo Laporte Yeah, shut it down. Didn’t – didn’t they just redesign it, I mean, it’s – it’s got the new…

Brian Brushwood We launched it as a complement to Facebook, kind of waving the white flag as complement.

Xeni Jardin Because Facebook just doesn’t have enough animated [indiscernible] (104:05) of kings.

Leo Laporte Right. You like us, you like Facebook, you love us.

Brian Brushwood But do you know my current position on Facebook is defined entirely by two years ago. John C. Dvorak’s position on MySpace because Facebook was the young upstart and John C. Dvorak said, I’m sure I’m going to misquoted but it was just like this is a fickle market. This is popular and what’s popular now is very rarely what’s popular two years from now, three years from now. And damn the phase not exactly where we are now.

Leo Laporte [ph] Iraq (104:32).

Brian Brushwood That’s right.

Owen JJ Stone That’s how it goes. When I first went to MySpace. What’s MySpace? You are not on MySpace. You get on MySpace through like MySpace. You’re still on MySpace, they laugh at you again. You still on MySpace? The way it was going to come and go, that’s why when everybody goes crazy about Facebook, I know the numbers but at some point what you just said, what John said, excuse me not what you said, because I’m not giving you credit. What John said is what happens in the market.

John C. Dvorak Well, he quoted.

Owen JJ Stone It happens.

Leo Laporte January 6th of this year –

John C. Dvorak Yeah, it can happen again.

Leo Laporte Paul Chambers was trying to get on a plane. He’s late. He arrives at the airport, he tweets and by the way, he has a few dozen followers. He tweets…

Brian Brushwood To his friends, he says to his friends.

Leo Laporte To his friends.

Brian Brushwood Out loud, to his friends.

Leo Laporte Robin Hood Airport is closed. You've got a week and a bit to get it together otherwise I’m blowing the airport sky high!

John C. Dvorak Yeah, you’re right. It’s a great one.

Leo Laporte Tweet might have faded into the obscurity of the Internet had it not been discovered five days later, not even at the time but five days later by an airport duty manager who forwarded it to his station manager.

John C. Dvorak Within – no, hey, this guy is going to blow the place up five days ago.

Leo Laporte Now, here’s the interesting thing. Even though the threat was deemed five days ago…

Owen JJ Stone [indiscernible] (105:54) it seems like whoa..

Leo Laporte Five days ago.

Owen JJ Stone Yeah, he was going to blow it up.

Leo Laporte Even though the threat was deemed non-credible because I guess five days later he hadn’t done it. It was passed on to the police. January 13th, he was arrested, he was questioned and he’s –

Owen JJ Stone [indiscernible] (106:10).

John C. Dvorak [indiscernible] (106:11).

Leo Laporte Who knows because he is now – on Thursday, Judge Jacqueline Davies at Doncaster Crown Court in – which is in England somewhere with the name like that and Robin Hood Airport, I think it’s probably kind of a rural airport, ordered him to pay $3,225 in prosecutorial costs –

John C. Dvorak Or pounds.

Leo Laporte Well, no, £2,000.

Brian Brushwood Yeah, yeah, 2,000 in U.S., 2,000 pounds.

Leo Laporte I converted it for you, John.

John C. Dvorak Got you.

Leo Laporte I know how you feel about that and a £385 fine. Stephen Fry, among others volunteered to – he said, whenever they fine you, I’ll pay.

John C. Dvorak Yes.

Leo Laporte But my favorite part of this story is now and if you search on Twitter for the hashtag “I am Spartacus.”

Owen JJ Stone Loved this.

Leo Laporte Thousands of people have tweeted the same tweet with the hashtag “I am Spartacus”.

Owen JJ Stone I’ve said so many worst things in this on Twitter and on the Internet.

Leo Laporte Wait a minute. You’ve threatened to blow up airports on Twitter?

Owen JJ Stone I’ve threatened to kill people and stab them.

Brian Brushwood What?

Owen JJ Stone Yes, I’ll kill you right now. I just said, I will stab you repeatedly.

John C. Dvorak He will – be careful.

Owen JJ Stone I will leave you dead in the streets fuckin hair.

Brian Brushwood Really? I’m your ride home.

Owen JJ Stone Look. You used to be my ride home. When I kill you, I’ll take the keys [indiscernible] (107:26) I am out. Now what? Who’s going to stop me now.

Leo Laporte Now, we should explain to the younger set. This ‘I am Spartacus’ comes from a movie – Burt Lancaster movie.

Brian Brushwood Yes, I didn’t know it was directed by Stanley Kubrick. They said Kubrick – it was a Kubrick movie. I didn’t know that.

Leo Laporte Well, that’s it. That is interesting.

Brian Brushwood But there is that famous scene when they say, they say, ‘we are Spartacus’ and one guy who is not Spartacus steps up and says ‘I am Spartacus’.

Leo Laporte Now, of course, there’s Tony Curtis. There is Kirk Douglas. Who’s that third guy?

Brian Brushwood Kirk Douglas. I can hear that’s Kirk Douglas.

Leo Laporte Kirk Douglas is Spartacus, right?

John C. Dvorak Yeah. He’s going to stand up.

[Video/Audio Presentation]

Leo Laporte They are all Spartacus. When you say a word over and over again, it starts to sound kind of funny?

Brian Brushwood Really? I have a question right here.

Leo Laporte So, all the slaves say they are Spartacus thereby making his identification impossible.

Brian Brushwood I think we all agree.

Leo Laporte So, they killed them all.

Brian Brushwood I think we all agree that this was a very silly, silly arrest that they made on this guy.

Leo Laporte Wait a minute. He threatened to blow up the airport.

Brian Brushwood Did he? It was deemed as a non-credible threat and after it was deemed a non-credible threat, then they went picked him up. This is a [ph] make word busy bodiness (108:44), right?

John C. Dvorak Who did he threat? Who did he threat to?

Leo Laporte He threated it to his 12 friends on Twitter.

Owen JJ Stone That’s right.

John C. Dvorak So what? What are they going to do about it? It’s not a threat – it’s not credible.

Owen JJ Stone Thank you. Like I said, I just threatened your life, now if you end up missing then we have a problem.

Brian Brushwood How do we feel about this whole ‘I am Spartacus’ thing? I think it’s kind of cool. It’s a movie solidarity.

Leo Laporte I like it, I like to see that.

Brian Brushwood What do you think? Do you like it? Thumbs up?

Owen JJ Stone I’m on Board.

Brian Brushwood Yeah, John, you down for this? You think it’s a good idea?

John C. Dvorak Yeah, I’m in. Coming.

Brian Brushwood Xeni, you down?

Xeni Jardin Yeah, fine.

John C. Dvorak Fine?

Owen JJ Stone Seems like [indiscernible] (109:18) you know, whatever…

Brian Brushwood It’s one thing – it’s one thing for --

Xeni Jardin [indiscernible] (109:20).

Leo Laporte Say again, say again. Oh, the DCSS, yes.

Xeni Jardin Sound like this is sort of a cyclical joke that is repeated in new ways, kind of like what we do with [indiscernible] (109:31) or jokes on –

Leo Laporte When DVD Jon decrypted the encryption of the CSS encryption on DVDs and it was made illegal. People would wear T-shirts that had the code, because you could write it pretty simply.

Brian Brushwood Right.

Leo Laporte And everybody. Remember the – remember the code when everybody on Digg posted – and Digg pulled it down at first, posted the code, the PGP or whatever –

John C. Dvorak Yeah, if you had on T-shirts, it’s all over the place.

Leo Laporte Yeah, yeah.

Owen JJ Stone That chat room says I am Dvorak and that will be our new [indiscernible] (110:02).

Brian Brushwood I am Dvorak.

Owen JJ Stone I am Dvorak.

Brian Brushwood Here’s what I want to say. It’s like it’s one thing for us to intellectually think this is a great idea, but I don’t know that I am such a coward, I don’t know that I have the courage to [indiscernible] (110:12) to type those words.

Leo Laporte Oh, Come on.

Owen JJ Stone I will tweet it out right now without the hashtag “I am Spartacus.” I would blow this [indiscernible] (110:18) airport…

Leo Laporte No, no, no, no, stop, wait a minute that’s the Royal Rum talking, shut up.

[Multiple speaker]

Brian Brushwood You know what, I propose…

Leo Laporte It’s on my machine, from my IP address.

Owen JJ Stone That’s why he is stopping me…

Brian Brushwood That’s right.

Owen JJ Stone Because it’s his machine. When they come back here five days later, they’re like who typed this? Ohdoctah!

[Multiple speaker]

Xeni Jardin I think all of you are subject, all of you are subject to the drunk tweet rule and you should not be touching Twitter right now.

Owen JJ Stone What man! No.

Leo Laporte They are not drunk. Are they drunk?

Owen JJ Stone No, who is drunk. My glass is empty.

Brian Brushwood No, I don’t, I mean, but there is like seriously, like when I think about like me really tweeting those words out, I was like I fly a lot, I don’t want to get on any list, I don’t want to – I honestly don’t know that I have the courage to participate in that.

John C. Dvorak There you have it. In a nutshell.

Leo Laporte Look at all those IM’s. These are all the IM’s from Spartacuses.

Owen JJ Stone I thought you supported I’m Spartacus. You do not, you do not support I’m Spartacus.

Brian Brushwood I totally do, but I’m a physical coward, that’s what I’m saying.

Owen JJ Stone You don’t support them.

Leo Laporte A lot of these I’m Spartacuses are today, and recently. I mean this is...

Brian Brushwood I’ll tell you what, I’m looking for I’m Dvoraks. I guarantee you they’re already out there on Twitter.

Owen JJ Stone I’m Dvorak.

Brian Brushwood Research for I’m Dvorak.

John C. Dvorak Oh, by the way.

Leo Laporte Yes. He is Dvorak.

John C. Dvorak Oh, I don’t – I got to plug something…

[Multiple speaker]

Owen JJ Stone I think [ph] let’s be baah (111:46) I’m Dvorak.

John C. Dvorak Which is my Editor at MarketWatch, David Callaway, I need some followers on Twitter.

Leo Laporte Oh, dear, I hate it when people do this.

John C. Dvorak I’m not going to do, I’ll do it next time because I got to get his exact name because there’s a million guys named David Callaway.

Leo Laporte You know what John…

John C. Dvorak I’m ill prepared to do this show.

Leo Laporte John if I may channel you, no one needs followers on Twitter.

Owen JJ Stone Actually John, that’s one thing about you that gets me, when you get on this whole followee-thing and you all grumpy [indiscernible] (112:12) look I don’t have any followers, you don’t see me ask for followers on this show. I still have a show, I have a lovely time, nobody even knows who I am…

Brian Brushwood You don’t see…

Owen JJ Stone …3000 times.

Brian Brushwood

Owen JJ Stone See he can spell my Twitter name, because I can’t spell, so that’s the trick against me. So John, pipe down and stop promoting a people’s Twitter. There is no Twitter, we don’t care lets move on. Next story.

Leo Laporte I don’t even know how you would know when the show is over.

Brian Brushwood That’s when the bugs starts coming in.

John C. Dvorak Give a minute, you guys got to finish the bottle, you’re not even two-thirds done.

Leo Laporte I’ll take care of the bottle. Where can we see Mr. Brian Brushwood?

Brian Brushwood Two places, two new places well, I guess three total, of course I’m doing Scam School over at Revision3, but NSFW every Tuesday night, we come up with group of games, like damn you autocorrect the game or you try to guess the game. Well, he drinks like crazy, and brand new…

John C. Dvorak Yeah right.

Brian Brushwood … a brand new release just due on iTunes, right here on the TWiT Network, Me and Thomas Merritt – Tom Merritt talk it about video whether it’s from YouTube, up to feature films, we’d called the show Frame Rates.

Leo Laporte You’re on that show.

Brian Brushwood News and commentary.

Leo Laporte And I green lighted it.

Brian Brushwood Apparently so. You’re, you’re probably drinking from that bottle when you just said, shut up…

Leo Laporte No, that’s awesome that’s – Frame Rates is an awesome show.

Brian Brushwood We’re having a lot of fun.

Leo Laporte And we’re very proud of having another TWiT now.

Brian Brushwood And Twitter@schwood, where you’ll not see me, saying that I’m Spartacus.

Leo Laporte Mr. Ohdoctah, JJ, Owen JJ Stone,

Owen JJ Stone It’s in a note, it’s in the show notes, you could check it out there.

Leo Laporte There is no show notes.

Owen JJ Stone And by the way look..

Leo Laporte What do you think this is like a professional podcast.

Owen JJ Stone I think that you don’t handle all that…

Leo Laporte Show notes…

Owen JJ Stone ...real professionals here handle it, but also I’ll kidnap Brian on Wednesday soon to be for random drinking, where we’re going to get drunk every Wednesday night and do a show.

[Multiple speakers]

Owen JJ Stone It will in the future.

Leo Laporte [indiscernible] (113:39) where is your father, he’ll kick you’re drinking.

Owen JJ Stone What, it’s only Wednesday.

Brian Brushwood I’m a teetotaler, I’ve never had a drink in my life.

Leo Laporte Never had a drink in his life.

Owen JJ Stone But, it’s only on Wednesday.

Leo Laporte Wednesday. John C. Dvorak, you could find him at…

John C. Dvorak,, don’t forget checking that out once in a while, we need all the support we can get and also I’m on and

Leo Laporte There you go. Xeni Jardin is at and really Xeni I’m just, sorry…

Xeni Jardin This is pretty, I felt like the lone male guest on the view. Except Whoopi and Barbara Walters had been hitting the whisky ahead of time, I don’t know what to say.

Owen JJ Stone You did bring up donkey love, I will say that. You and Leo.

Leo Laporte I think I started it though. Xeni…

Xeni Jardin It was that [indiscernible] (114:24) on Amazon [indiscernible] (114:25).

Leo Laporte We adore you, we think you’re great and we thank you for putting up with us.

Xeni Jardin I had a lot of fun.

Leo Laporte Thank you for being here and…

Xeni Jardin I talked trash about you on the back channel by the way no more [indiscernible] (114:32)

Owen JJ Stone I re-tweeted it, I re-tweeted that tweet I saw it.

Leo Laporte No more what…

Xeni Jardin I don’t want any more Twitter followers.

Leo Laporte Yes, yes, yes she does.

Xeni Jardin Can I just say really, Twitter is more fun when you’ve fewer followers because there are fewer people to heckle you and it’s more fun when you’re not being heckled.

John C. Dvorak Hey I’m not trying to get more followers for myself I’m being magnanimous and trying to get my editors some followers.

Owen JJ Stone Somebody is feeling guilty. Xeni follows me so I’m really happy all over.

Xeni Jardin It was really nice meeting you.

Owen JJ Stone It was nice meeting you too.

Leo Laporte Oh, no signal, that’s not good.

Brian Brushwood Blue screen of death.

Leo Laporte Yeah, that’s not good, when it happens.

Owen JJ Stone Windows.

Leo Laporte Wow. Well, I don’t know if we’re on the air or not but I think our…

Brian Brushwood Should get a picture of this, no signal.

Leo Laporte Look there is people crawling at my feet now to fix this.

Brian Brushwood Oh, we missed it.

Leo Laporte They’ve all got these cameras out.

Brian Brushwood I was all excited I was going to get some blue screen.

Leo Laporte Thank you very much John for fixing that. I must have, see we’ve designed this studio so cleverly so that in fact there is something at my foot that can take us off the air.

Owen JJ Stone Got it.

Leo Laporte Just in case, I can just kick that by accident.

Brian Brushwood So when you start dancing, you’re almost guaranteed to go off the air.

Xeni Jardin That was actually karmic payback for asking for Twitter followers.

Brian Brushwood There you go.

Owen JJ Stone Can we call the show techdonkeys?

Leo Laporte No, stop it go away. Go away.

Brian Brushwood And you’re gone.

Leo Laporte Stop it. Xeni is on Twitter where the data flows if you want to follow her but you mustn’t.

Xeni Jardin You’ve call me Madam Boing.

Leo Laporte Madam Boing.

Owen JJ Stone She did rag on us in her Twitter stream she was all upset…

Leo Laporte I’m checking it out right now.

Owen JJ Stone …about the boys club.

Leo Laporte She say, I feel like I stumbled into a drunken locker room, I have no business being in.

Owen JJ Stone It’s not safe in here.

Leo Laporte And then she is speaking in some strange language, I don’t even know – looks like Vietnamese, do you speak Vietnamese?

Xeni Jardin Try it phonetically, Leo, say the words phonetically.

Brian Brushwood This is where it’s going to end up.

Leo Laporte [ph] Bung-wo-wai (116:20)..

Xeni Jardin Oh, what, no that, I actually was speaking in Vietnamese there. It’s a really good soup.

Leo Laporte Ladies and gentlemen, another TWiT has long been in the can. Thank you for being here. You know, I have a few thing to plug, I should probably mention that we are going to do a best up for the holiday season, if you would kindly go to you can vote for your favorite bits from the past year, that – that we were afterward – a week after Christmas.

Also Kevin Kelly will be joining us on Wednesday for our special interview segment, we will be the doing signature interviews every Wednesday at 4 pm Pacific, 7 pm Eastern, that is 2200 UTC at Tom Merritt and I talk to Kevin Kelly, one of the Founders of oddly enough Wired Magazine. Who is also a really great writer, he wrote the book on the hive mind, he is great, I love Kevin.

Xeni Jardin And that book is wonderful.

Leo Laporte I’ve got to get it and read it before we talk to him. I think it’s very – I’ve heard him talk about it and I think it’s really [indiscernible] (117:19).

Owen JJ Stone What’s it called.

Leo Laporte Do you know, do you remember it, I don’t remember it either.

Xeni Jardin What Technology Wants.

Leo Laporte That’s it, What Technology Wants.

Xeni Jardin I was trying to think of how to translate that into Vietnamese.

Leo Laporte Bo wai hai, Do you speak Vietnamese?

Xeni Jardin No I just speak the name of the menu items on the…

Leo Laporte Just the soup. And tomorrow at 10 am we will be live with out coverage of the Facebook announcement, whatever it might be, Tom Merritt and company at That’s 10 am Pacific, 1 pm Eastern. And I always have to do the math, I think that’s 1800 UTC at Thank you, Brian Brushwood. Thank you, Ohdoctah. Thank you, John C. Dvorak. Thank you, Xeni Jardin.

Brian Brushwood Thank you Royal Rum.

John C. Dvorak So long everybody.

Leo Laporte Good night everybody, thank you [indiscernible] (118:00) see you later, bye bye. See you next Monday.

Xeni Jardin Bye.

Leo Laporte Thank you, Xeni. I’m so sorry.

This is TWiT, This Week in Tech, episode 717, no that’s wrong, Christ.


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